God

"Like computer viruses, successful mind viruses will tend to be hard for their victims to detect. If you are the victim of one, the chances are that you won't know it, and may even vigorously deny it."
 
That because thats a kind of joke thread. Obviously if there are two arguments there will be some critisizm, after all that is a fundemental component that anything claimed as true should be put through. Instead of continuous dogma that says whatever i say is true, and no one is to say otherwise, even if it is obviously untrue (not directed at god)
 
Perhaps it started more nonserious, but that doesn't void the grativas of some of the things that were pondered and the connections made.

A lot of people see the title "God" and get put off...because they subscribe to their own dogma and what they say goes, which can be seen in replies that obviously had little thought put into it...Or maybe they're just too lazy to consider what anyone else had posted.
 
LeiYunFat said:
Perhaps it started more nonserious, but that doesn't void the grativas of some of the things that were pondered and the connections made.

A lot of people see the title "God" and get put off...because they subscribe to their own dogma and what they say goes, which can be seen in replies that obviously had little thought put into it...Or maybe they're just too lazy to consider what anyone else had posted.
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nothing is going to change my mind, but that doesn't mean i haven't considered the other side of the argument.
 
Sorry if you thought I was taking shots at you...I wasn't and I didn't intend to.


I guess I'll throw in as well. Basically my thoughts are central away from God. In a lot of religious-fueled arguments and concepts, God is almost central. That God is of ultimate importance. I believe the opposite. I belive that the concept of God as a father, spirit, guide, judge, or whether or not God exists at all...is totally irrelevant. If indeed God exists and is everything, and is in everything...then really, he is nothing. Taking a nod towards Buddhist thought, everything is nothing, and nothing is everything. Like I said in the heaven thread,

Have you ever drifted off to sleep, but before you did, you had a rush of images and sounds from all around you? It felt like everything was still very vivid and in your last moments of conciousness, you were able to register and comprehend everything that went on...That might be what death is like, only thousands of times more intense...If we did indeed die and assimilate with The Big Guy, it WOULD be everything we want. God IS everything and we would become one with everything. God doesn't have to give us motorcycles or tits to play with, for we have trancended all need and want. We would trancend all being and identity...This would also be nirvana.

Yes I think it is also true that we probably cease to exist, but the feeling of oneness and wholeness is not fleeting by any means. I think it is important to live your life to the best of your ability, as when you die, you don't get a second chance. Your atoms will eventually be reconsituted within other living beings, but you will never again be the whole living organism you are now.

Obviously this is all just me writing down my thoughts.
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So what is important? Life, and how you live it. Everyone dies the same death, and I think everyone experiences the same assimilation at the end of their lives. So what stops someone from living in "sin"...if there are no consequences in death? Absolutely nothing. I guess this would seem wrong to a lot of you, since this would mean there would be no consequences for acting on whatever impulse came your way. But I do believe there are certain truths and laws that reveal themselves with the right lens. Let's take truth, for example. The opposite of telling the truth would be lying. But lying only works when people expect you to tell the truth. If you took lying to the maximum, however, to where everyone lies and lying is expected, you get a resultant of chaos. There would be no order because there would be only lies. The opposite of many laws that govern atleast our world, when taken to their maxima, would lead to chaos. This is the basis of discerning what is right and what is wrong, without ever having to subscribe to religious dogma...such as, "If I steal this, or if I tell this lie, I will be punished for eternity."

Therefore without having to know whether or not God exists, it is easier to gauge the nature of God, if God were to exist. Not that it matters to me, you see. If I live my life to the best of my ability, there there is nothing else I need.
 
wow. this is quite interesting and by the same token, a little disturbing.
 
Im not sure what your purpose was in that statement.

Morals dont come from scriptures, so obviously being an atheist you are still morally guided. Indicators of moral existed thousands of years before the scriptures, and if anything, the bible has opressed moral progession. Also noting that people pick and choose what they want to live by in the bible.
 
if you want to believe in the tooth fairy, that's fine. However, there is more anecdotal evidence for God than the tooth fery. Also, doesn't the tooth feiry myth say that the tooth feiry will exchange all teeth for money? Just put a tooth under your pillow, sit there all night and if there isn't money there the next morning, then the tooth feiry doesn't exist :p
 
we cant prove it doesnt exist, although that doesnt make it the slightest bit possible does it. Just like something else i know ;)
 
matt182 said:
Faith is powerful enough to immunize people against all appeals to pity, to forgiveness, to decent human feelings. It even immunizes them against fear, if they honestly believe that a martyr's death will send them straight to heaven.

Everyones an atheist in some respect, you dont beleive in thor do you, but others just take it one step further. I assume your relgious beliefs are what your parents are, most likely. If you were born in india you would be hindu. The indoctrination of children is a powerfull tool kind of like hard wiring the childs brain that is gullible to beleive in something, acting kind of like a mind virus that keeps getting passed on generation to next, memetic.

All races had gods, its just a natural thing to explain something because i suspect that we human have a need to understand and that god fufills this role.

We are trying to understand how we have got a complicated world, and we have an explanation in terms of a slightly simpler world, and we explain that in terms of a slightly simpler world and it all hangs together down to an ultimately simple world.
Now, God is not an explanation of that kind. God himself cannot be simple if he has power to do all the things he is supposed to do.
-- Richard Dawkins, "Nick Pollard interviews Richard Dawkins"
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You would pick Richard Dawkins--the ultimate atheist to bring a point into this. You didn't pick this thred up after a year dead to bring some sort of discussion into the board. You simply wanted to argue. I'm not sure why you've decided to hit up 3 of my posts to make some sort of point that you don't believe in God.

And was your entire post just reciting what Richard Dawkins said or did you have an original thought yourself?

Faith is great. I have faith that the lightbulb will turn on when I flip the light switch. Do I know it will? No. It might be burned out. But I have faith it will. I have faith that my best friend will have time to drink with me. Do I know he will? No. He might be busy with his wife. Did he have time tonight? Yes. I have faith that this site will be ready to post to tomorrow. Can I be sure? No. It's been offline some times.

Your paragraph with everyone being an atheist to some extent and not believing in Thor is off-kilter. Atheism is the belief of no God. I belive in God, so I'm not atheist. But even being an atheist is to be religious. If atheism is to have a stance on the existance of God or higher power. And religion is based on a higher power, then atheists are religious.

My father took me to a Catholic Mass for one Christmas. My mom went to a Methodist church a few times. I visited a Jewish Synagogue with my best friend and my parents were supportive. I dabbled in Witchcraft and my parents were supportive. What's your point? That becuase my mom and dad belived one thing that I belived the same? They have an affilitation to one political party, I'm a member of the opposite.

Seriously, there are better things to argue about.
 
matt182 said:
Im not sure what your purpose was in that statement.

Morals dont come from scriptures, so obviously being an atheist you are still morally guided. Indicators of moral existed thousands of years before the scriptures, and if anything, the bible has opressed moral progession. Also noting that people pick and choose what they want to live by in the bible.
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Morals are taught by parents which are passed down by society. This society is predominately Christian.

I was watching Discovery and a few other shows which showed other socities that held a 'dog eat dog' attitude. The norm was murder, rape, etc...this was taught by society as acceptable. Soooo...this was passed down from society to parent to child.
 
Matt-
Have you read The Bible from cover to cover? Have you read some of the constructionists of The Bible? Do you really have any basis on what you are talking about? Do you really know anything about Christianity?
 
evolution said:
You would pick Richard Dawkins--the ultimate atheist to bring a point into this. You didn't pick this thred up after a year dead to bring some sort of discussion into the board. You simply wanted to argue. I'm not sure why you've decided to hit up 3 of my posts to make some sort of point that you don't believe in God.
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Well if it seems that way sorry ill try not to next time ;)


evolution said:
And was your entire post just reciting what Richard Dawkins said or did you have an original thought yourself?

Faith is great. I have faith that the lightbulb will turn on when I flip the light switch. Do I know it will? No. It might be burned out. But I have faith it will. I have faith that my best friend will have time to drink with me. Do I know he will? No. He might be busy with his wife. Did he have time tonight? Yes. I have faith that this site will be ready to post to tomorrow. Can I be sure? No. It's been offline some times.
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That is not faith, just like dropping a ball to the ground. One is to suspect the ball will fall. But this is affirmed by enourmous evidence such as gravity, physics, motion etc. It is reasonable to believe the ball will fall. Faith on the otherhand if you are unware is belief in something that has no evidence.

evolution said:
Your paragraph with everyone being an atheist to some extent and not believing in Thor is off-kilter. Atheism is the belief of no God. I belive in God, so I'm not atheist. But even being an atheist is to be religious. If atheism is to have a stance on the existance of God or higher power. And religion is based on a higher power, then atheists are religious.
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Thats a bit misguided. A metaphysical is a explanation is not associated with a diety. Religion is based on a creator who is massively complex who is said to have existed since the begining of time (if that is a proper word?)

Explaining the unkown by the known is logical but explaining the known by the unkown is bound to be useless.
 
And yes i do have a sense what the bible is about, i was raised a christian went to a christian primary and high school. But having been able to intelligently think for myself have led away to what i was have :p
 
err.. the ball will fall, that's a fact and we know it will happen. The examples evo mentioned we don't know for sure if will happen..
 
Here's my stance.

We can't prove that there is a god, and we can't prove that there isn't one.

I made the conscious to be non religious in the traditional sense. I do not worship a "higher being" but I do think that there is a lot about life and this world that we are incapable of understanding. Maybe I'm just spiritual, but not religious.
 
Umm i think you need to get your facts right about waht faith means. And by the way a ball falling down is not a fact.

We know the light will most probably turn on because of electril current and enourmous evidence that it is what causes light, and we also know that light bulbs have a lifespan. I dont think faith is the correct word, merely causing confusion as we can see.

I beleive in Zues, why dont you?
 
If you want to believe in Zues, that's fine with me, but I don't.

And ok, on earth a ball will fall if it's within the earth's gravitational pull (way to be a nitpic, Matt). If Evo's friend will join him for drinks is uncertan. And lightblubs break all the time. Why can't you just accept and respect other people's believes?
 
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