Counting Calories from Supplements

[Darth Pooh]

I was wondering if anyone here counts their supplements calories as part of their daily caloric intake when in a deficit or is it considered neglible to them?

For instance, I am taking 6 grams of fish oil and 4 grams of CLA's. Technically, this is 100 calories right there... I count it towards my macro's for the day but not my calories.

I wanted to get an idea of what other people did.

 

[ali2]

I don't count them...although I guess maybe you should but in my view they are negligible...

 

[Steve]

I count them.

The more weight you have to lose, the more important it becomes... less wiggle room and all that.

But I don't really track calories. I track macros, which to an extent, it the same thing. If your macros are in check, so are your calories.

 

[Darth Pooh]

I knew you counted, this is actually what got me to thinking.

I am not sure if I am in the right place to be counting mine or not.

You know I am in a CUT right now... so it's hard to gauge what I should be taking in calorie wise. I take in 1900 (+100 for those supps), so some people would think I am too high with calories for a cut (at 10 cals a lb, 1790 cals, at 11 cals a lb, 1969 cals). I believe my protein and fat macros are in check, I don't really do carbs though. If I went to 12 cals a lb... than I am too low. I believe my BMR is at 1900, but that is a crap calculator and I don't really know, that is such a rough estimate it is awful to even want to use it.

So, ideally, I might need to move this topic and my questions to another forum altogether for now...

 

[Steve]

I think you're thinking too much.

Calories are calories.... so it doesn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense not to count every calories that goes into your body. Not counting calories from supps simply makes your estimates even more estimated... if that's possible, lol.

I mean, if you were popping one fish oil per day, that's like 10 calories. I wouldn't concern myself with that. But when you're popping 100 calories on a 2000 calorie diet, that's 5%, which, as I said above, can start making a difference overtime if that 5% is continually making your supposed deficit a maintenance or surplus.

If progress is being realized, I wouldn't sweat stuff to this extent. If it's not, that's when it's time to dig deeper.

 

[jadedazurite]

Yes, I log my 30 per day of fish oil supplement. I also log every strawberry or grape and weigh all my meat portions by gram on a digital food scale. I'm only trying to lose about 15lbs, but I just like to keep an account that's as accurate as possible. Over the last month I've lost nearly an inch off my waist without the number on the scale going down at all, so I feel like I really need to be accurate in tracking what I'm doing.

 

[JDhd]

I don't count calories from my supplements because I'm only taking a multivitamin, which contains very few if any calories.

If I were drinking protein shakes or taking oils etc... I would count them. Calories are energy and you need to make sure you're using more energy than you're consuming to lose what you have stored. A couple hundred calories a day could possibly make a difference, especially considering the difficulty in determining energy output.

 

[Darth Pooh]

I think you're thinking too much.

Calories are calories.... so it doesn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense not to count every calories that goes into your body. Not counting calories from supps simply makes your estimates even more estimated... if that's possible, lol.

I mean, if you were popping one fish oil per day, that's like 10 calories. I wouldn't concern myself with that. But when you're popping 100 calories on a 2000 calorie diet, that's 5%, which, as I said above, can start making a difference overtime if that 5% is continually making your supposed deficit a maintenance or surplus.

If progress is being realized, I wouldn't sweat stuff to this extent. If it's not, that's when it's time to dig deeper.

I am probably more confused than ever due to the stage I am in. This doesn't mean I am not enjoying myself, because I actually am. I like the "planning" of it all, but I am not sure where I am supposed to see results or how. I think I have an idea... CLEAN CUT = LOSS of BF with maintained lean muscle. So, I think the scale should go down since I won't be adding LM, but I do want to make sure I am in an appropriate deficit (which I know I am at 2000 calories per day).

 

[Darth Pooh]

Yes, I log my 30 per day of fish oil supplement. I also log every strawberry or grape and weigh all my meat portions by gram on a digital food scale. I'm only trying to lose about 15lbs, but I just like to keep an account that's as accurate as possible. Over the last month I've lost nearly an inch off my waist without the number on the scale going down at all, so I feel like I really need to be accurate in tracking what I'm doing.

Yeah, sounds like you are cutting like I am. So you are saying the scale isn't moving but the inches are? Same as me... which can be confusing. The idea is to lose BF, but at the caloric deficits we are at, we shouldn't be able to gain appreciable LM to break even. So, are we losing BF or water weight or glycogen stores? I sure as heck don't know.

I don't count calories from my supplements because I'm only taking a multivitamin, which contains very few if any calories.

If I were drinking protein shakes or taking oils etc... I would count them. Calories are energy and you need to make sure you're using more energy than you're consuming to lose what you have stored. A couple hundred calories a day could possibly make a difference, especially considering the difficulty in determining energy output.

I agree, I don't even think MULTI's have calorie information on their labels (the one I have I believe doesn't or says ZERO). I also drink protein shakes everyday (2 scoops, half a banana and 15 grams of peanut butter) and I love them... so of course I count the 350 calories or so that comes from that... so I see your point, a macro has calories and should be counted. Thanks for your feedback...

 

[Steve]

I am probably more confused than ever due to the stage I am in. This doesn't mean I am not enjoying myself, because I actually am. I like the "planning" of it all, but I am not sure where I am supposed to see results or how. I think I have an idea... CLEAN CUT = LOSS of BF with maintained lean muscle. So, I think the scale should go down since I won't be adding LM, but I do want to make sure I am in an appropriate deficit (which I know I am at 2000 calories per day).

Yea, but I think a lot of people get caught up on what *should* be a deficit based on the calculations and estimated of input vs. output. They use that as their benchmark for reality and it doesn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense, namely do to such things as metabolic individuality, miscalculations, the vagueness of the estimations, etc, etc.

You should be holding on to muscle if you're eating adequate protein and lifting properly... at least most of it. You never know too, you could gain some... it's not written in stone that you won't.

If you're in a deficit, you should be losing fat too. If the fat isn't coming off, given enough time, it's time to tweak the numbers. I know a lot of people around here immediately like to jump on the "it's the hormones ohmygodzzz!!!111" wagon but that's nonsense. Yea, hormones play big role in our bodily regulations but we shouldn't assume the worse when there's probably a much easier answer. Not until we exhaust all possible avenues should we be concerned with the hormonal side of things.

I forget, what body fat do you think you're at right now? Do you have an idea? Is it just your belly that's giving you a problem?

 

[Steve]

Yeah, sounds like you are cutting like I am. So you are saying the scale isn't moving but the inches are? Same as me... which can be confusing. The idea is to lose BF, but at the caloric deficits we are at, we shouldn't be able to gain appreciable LM to break even. So, are we losing BF or water weight or glycogen stores? I sure as heck don't know.

Oh dude, when you're sweating the last few pounds, that's when scale weight should be thrown completely out the damn window. So much shit is going on that it's impossible to tell anything significant or worthwhile from scale weight.

Go by looks.

And inches.

 

[4everSome1Else]

I do count calories, well I just started.

 

[Darth Pooh]

Yea, but I think a lot of people get caught up on what *should* be a deficit based on the calculations and estimated of input vs. output. They use that as their benchmark for reality and it doesn't make a whole heck of a lot of sense, namely do to such things as metabolic individuality, miscalculations, the vagueness of the estimations, etc, etc.

You should be holding on to muscle if you're eating adequate protein and lifting properly... at least most of it. You never know too, you could gain some... it's not written in stone that you won't.

If you're in a deficit, you should be losing fat too. If the fat isn't coming off, given enough time, it's time to tweak the numbers. I know a lot of people around here immediately like to jump on the "it's the hormones ohmygodzzz!!!111" wagon but that's nonsense. Yea, hormones play big role in our bodily regulations but we shouldn't assume the worse when there's probably a much easier answer. Not until we exhaust all possible avenues should we be concerned with the hormonal side of things.

I forget, what body fat do you think you're at right now? Do you have an idea? Is it just your belly that's giving you a problem?

Ok, I believe I am at 18% BF, no clue though. I know at one point I was 33 - 35%, but obviously my Tanita scale is the least accurate thing to use. I might as well blindfold myself and throw at a dart board and see what number comes up as my BF. I never thought hormones were an issue and that is fairly verified through my existing track record (and I don't think I all of a sudden developed one over a 100 lbs in).

Oh dude, when you're sweating the last few pounds, that's when scale weight should be thrown completely out the damn window. So much shit is going on that it's impossible to tell anything significant or worthwhile from scale weight.

Go by looks.

And inches.

Right-o. I lost 3 inches this past Sunday... no weight change. However, I did for one of those two weeks get as high as 2400 calories per day, which was interesting to say the least as far as food consumption goes. You also know my other methods of cutting... so I won't exactly reiterate them here. I def think I look CUTTER... I really do. But could my judgment be off? Perhaps if I want this SO badly I could begin to believe my own delusions.

 

[Steve]

Take pictures.

 

[Darth Pooh]

Take pictures.

Fair enough.

 

[Steve]

When I used to cut, I'd take monthly pictures. If my measurements were budging, the scale wasn't budging, and especially if the pictures weren't looking different at all... I'd modify some things.

 

[ali2]

Ok guys - this may be a little off the topic but since you two already went off topic, I am joining the fray...

By macronutrients I know you mean protein, carbs and fat - how important is it exactly to take in certain amounts of each through the day as opposed to eating a specific number of calories?

I am terrible at tracking things, mostly because I forget so while I am aiming at taking in 1800 calories/day, I do not track what portion of those calories come from protein/carbs/fat. I do not believe that I am overeating in any one area but you never know for sure unless you are tracking.

I am comfortable with my caloric intake, however as I move further through this thing, my goals are changing from just losing weight to becoming a better 'phsical specimen' so to speak and if there is something I can be doing to move that along or assist with my goals, then I am open to it.

I hope this makes sense, thanks

 

[Steve]

Getting a handle on your calories is definitely most critical. But once you have a handle on that, figuring out your macros is pretty important.

For starters, there's certain essential components of macros; essential amino acids and essential fatty acids. By essential, we're saying you have to obtain these foods externally through your diet.

Secondly, macros have different impacts and roles on health, performance, etc. For instance, inadequate protein for some can lead to muscle loss. A lack of carbohydrates for some can lead to a decrease in performance. The list goes on.

A calorie is a calorie no matter how you slice it. However a nutrient is not a nutrient, they're not all created equal.

 

[Darth Pooh]

Getting a handle on your calories is definitely most critical. But once you have a handle on that, figuring out your macros is pretty important.

For starters, there's certain essential components of macros; essential amino acids and essential fatty acids. By essential, we're saying you have to obtain these foods externally through your diet.

Secondly, macros have different impacts and roles on health, performance, etc. For instance, inadequate protein for some can lead to muscle loss. A lack of carbohydrates for some can lead to a decrease in performance. The list goes on.

A calorie is a calorie no matter how you slice it. However a nutrient is not a nutrient, they're not all created equal.

I think Ali knows that carbs, fats, and proteins metabolize differently in the system. I think she might want a way to figure out the breakdown of them per day (possibly by percentages).

I stick to getting in .8 grams of protein for 1 lb of weight. This isn't the HIGH end nor the LOW end of protein intake, but somewhere in the middle. If I were to start a clean bulk, I'd probably go as high as 1.5 grams per lb. As far as fats go, I try to take in about 20 percent of my daily intake as fats (clean stuff, like peanut butter, almonds, fish oils) which for me is about 380 calories (very easy to do when almonds are 130 fat cals per serving + 40 protein cals (makes for about 7 grams of protein per serving). The rest comes from carbs... like my fruits, veggies and whole grains (wild brown rice, whole grain bread, oatmeal). I don't actually calculate those. I make sure I get in the fats and proteins and know that the carbs fall into place. Fish oils count towards your fats (1200 mg = 1.2 grams = 10 calories from fat). This generally has worked for me in the past month...

Getting in protein is HARD, you feel like you are always eating. Having a 3 egg breakfast only gets in 13% of my daily protein. I have turned to a postworkout shake that consists of two scoops of Whey protein (49 grams), half of a banana (for post workout carbs, replaces glycogen) and half a serving of peanut butter (for more protein and added yummyness). Water and ice, the magic bullet does the rest... it's almost like cheating everyday. I am like Steve in the sense that we are of the FEW out there that looks forward to drinking their shakes (he uses a different brand). Hell, I drink that stuff straight with water and powder and still love it... and I've got my protein almost 1/3 gone. The rest comes from the diet... hope any of this helps. Remember though, different people have different "plans" that work for them. Steve might think my plan is totally sloppy and not acceptable, that's why he is considered a forum prick

Remember, things metabolize differently in my body than yours for various reasons (male/female, muscle/fat ratios, cool/uncool).

 

[Steve]

I think Ali knows that carbs, fats, and proteins metabolize differently in the system. I think she might want a way to figure out the breakdown of them per day (possibly by percentages).

Well as you're eluding to below... I'm not a fan of percentages so good on you.

I stick to getting in .8 grams of protein for 1 lb of weight. This isn't the HIGH end nor the LOW end of protein intake, but somewhere in the middle. If I were to start a clean bulk, I'd probably go as high as 1.5 grams per lb.

I actually go about things in the opposite direction. When I'm cutting down, my protein intake is higher than when I'm bulking.

As far as fats go, I try to take in about 20 percent of my daily intake as fats (clean stuff, like peanut butter, almonds, fish oils) which for me is about 380 calories (very easy to do when almonds are 130 fat cals per serving + 40 protein cals (makes for about 7 grams of protein per serving). .

20-30% from fat seems to be the going average for optimal intake.

If you want to work with absolute numbers, this usually comes to about .25-.5 grams per pound.

The rest comes from carbs... like my fruits, veggies and whole grains (wild brown rice, whole grain bread, oatmeal). I don't actually calculate those. I make sure I get in the fats and proteins and know that the carbs fall into place.

Funnily enough that's most often how I go about things. Make sure I'm getting adequate aminos and efas and let the rest fall into place.