Aleeluh
New member
Oh geez, I really don't have anything to say but I do agree with you.. some people heh!What do you believe?
- Thread starter Aleeluh
- Start date
Oh geez, I really don't have anything to say but I do agree with you.. some people heh!
niapage
New member
This is an interesting discussion - and I don't really want to derail it with a joke -but I love george Carlin's bit on the 10 commandments and totally agree
EORGE CARLIN ON THE 10 COMMANDMENTS
from "Complaints and Grievances" (HBO special)
Here is my problem with the ten commandments- why exactly are there 10?
You simply do not need ten. The list of ten commandments was artificially and deliberately inflated to get it up to ten. Here's what happened:
About 5,000 years ago a bunch of religious and political hustlers got together to try to figure out how to control people and keep them in line. They knew people were basically stupid and would believe anything they were told, so they announced that God had given them some commandments, up on a mountain, when no one was around.
Well let me ask you this- when they were making this shit up, why did they pick 10? Why not 9 or 11? I'll tell you why- because 10 sound official. Ten sounds important! Ten is the basis for the decimal system, it's a decade, it's a psychologically satisfying number (the top ten, the ten most wanted, the ten best dressed). So having ten commandments was really a marketing decision! It is clearly a bullshit list. It's a political document artificially inflated to sell better. I will now show you how you can reduce the number of commandments and come up with a list that's a little more workable and logical. I am going to use the Roman Catholic version because those were the ones I was taught as a little boy.
Let's start with the first three:
I AM THE LORD THY GOD THOU SHALT NOT HAVE STRANGE GODS BEFORE ME
THOU SHALT NOT TAKE THE NAME OF THE LORD THY GOD IN VAIN
THOU SHALT KEEP HOLY THE SABBATH
Right off the bat the first three are pure bullshit. Sabbath day? Lord's name? strange gods? Spooky language! Designed to scare and control primitive people. In no way does superstitious nonsense like this apply to the lives of intelligent civilized humans in the 21st century. So now we're down to 7. Next:
HONOR THY FATHER AND MOTHER
Obedience, respect for authority. Just another name for controlling people. The truth is that obedience and respect shouldn't be automatic. They should be earned and based on the parent's performance. Some parents deserve respect, but most of them don't, period. You're down to six.
Now in the interest of logic, something religion is very uncomfortable with, we're going to jump around the list a little bit.
THOU SHALT NOT STEAL
THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS
Stealing and lying. Well actually, these two both prohibit the same kind of behavior- dishonesty. So you don't really need two you combine them and call the commandment "thou shalt not be dishonest". And suddenly you're down to 5.
And as long as we're combining I have two others that belong together:
THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTRY
THOU SHALT NOT COVET THY NEIGHBOR'S WIFE
Once again, these two prohibit the same type of behavior. In this case it is marital infidelity. The difference is- coveting takes place in the mind. But I don't think you should outlaw fantasizing about someone else's wife because what is a guy gonna think about when he's waxing his carrot? But, marital infidelity is a good idea so we're gonna keep this one and call it "thou shalt not be unfaithful". And suddenly we're down to four.
But when you think about it, honesty and infidelity are really part of the same overall value so, in truth, you could combine the two honesty commandments with the two fidelity commandments and give them simpler language, positive language instead of negative language and call the whole thing "thou shalt always be honest and faithful" and we're down to 3.
THOU SHALT NOT COVET THY NEIGHBOR"S GOODS
This one is just plain fuckin' stupid. Coveting your neighbor's goods is what keeps the economy going! Your neighbor gets a vibrator that plays "o come o ye faithful", and you want one too! Coveting creates jobs, so leave it alone. You throw out coveting and you're down to 2 now- the big honesty and fidelity commandment and the one we haven't talked about yet:
THOU SHALT NOT KILL
Murder. But when you think about it, religion has never really had a big problem with murder. More people have been killed in the name of god than for any other reason. All you have to do is look at Northern Ireland, Cashmire, the Inquisition, the Crusades, and the World Trade Center to see how seriously the religious folks take thou shalt not kill. The more devout they are, the more they see murder as being negotiable. It depends on who's doin the killin' and who's gettin' killed. So, with all of this in mind, I give you my revised list of the two commandments:
Thou shalt always be honest and faithful to the provider of thy nookie.
&
Thou shalt try real hard not to kill anyone, unless of course they pray to a different invisible man than you.
Two is all you need; Moses could have carried them down the hill in his fuckin' pocket. I wouldn't mind those folks in Alabama posting them on the courthouse wall, as long as they provided one additional commandment:
Thou shalt keep thy religion to thyself.
Totally agree!!I used 10 because thats what you see 10 commandments but there really shouldn't be an exact #!My point in all of this said things are totally WAY WAY WAY differently now and things cahnge to and we shouldn't be going by rules commandments whatever that were writtened how long ago also my brother is baptist and tries to overwelm me with his beliefs and tries to force church on me ect then again he drinks and does things that are not 100% by the book example used to get free cable if ya know what I mean isn't that STEALING I love my bro but it's all bologna lol!
Aleeluh
New member
I get what you are saying=] One of my aunts is like your brother! Every Christmas I get a Christian cd, which thats all fine and dandy- but she pushes her beliefs on everyone too. She does so many things that baffle me .. I just wish people didn't do that. =[
jennbabe06
New member
Religon...hmmm
This is one topic I find hard to really explain what I feel and believe...but I will give it a try...maybe some of you can make sense of my many thoughts lol
I was born and raised a Catholic. Well not fully raised I guess. When I was really little I did go to church every saturday or sunday. But as me and my sister got older and we had our new baby brother my dad working rotating 12s my mom really just kinda fell out of taking a baby a four year old and a 6 year old to church once a week by herself.
Up through my sophmore year of high school I went to religon classes that were held before school started each morning leaving one day out of the week to go to church before school started. Once in high school my mom said that I can choose weather or not to go to religon. She thought I was old enough to pick what I wanted to believe in or do when it came to religion.
My mom was rasied from a very very very religious family (which might be way we aren't really practicing catholics to this day) I went to religion up through my sophmore year not really thrilled with the catholic church. I belive in a go and that Jesus was born and died on the cross to save us....but there are so many things I don't quite believe in and understand through the catholic church. While attend religion once a week through highschool I also attend a youth group through a local christain church. I learned and uderstoond things more in that year than I did over the last 10 years in my catholic religion classes.
To this day I go to church only a few times a year. I go for christmas eve mass and weddings and baptisms and for some other things. But other than that I really haven't been to church for the soul purpose of going to church.
Somethings I don't like about the Catholic Church:
The whole "tradition of it all"
the whole thing where we are the the most important religion and how we shun all others and how catholic are like royalty
I also don't understand why to confess your sins you must go to a priest once a month (if i do this i do it at home in my own prayers)
Why you must say "the hail mary" 10 times in a row before a our father on the rossary. There is this tradtion around her that people go to church early to pray the rossary before mass. Does this make you closer to god if you pray.
Durning school you were asked not to wear jeans to church. Now coming from a not so rich family compared to others Jeans is what I own...no skirts no dress that were "nice enough" (but now people can wear jeans to christmas mass and no one will say a word to ya about it.
If and when I pray I do it with meaning. Not to just pray not just because it's just they way it is. Not just because it is the churches tradition and has been for 300 years.
And old friend of mine and I once got in a fight about church. She thinks because she goes to church once a week. confesses all of her sins once a month to a priest makes her a better christain than I. I'm sorry but I don't believe that going to church and confessing all your sins to a priest one minute than going out that very same day and comitting all of those sins all over again is right. I know my sins I know that some things that I say or do is wrong in the "eyes of the lord" but I don't go preaching and praising that I am a good catholic and that I confess all my sins to god and then go out and do them all over again and not think twice about it.
See what I mean...I am very indifferent...I have my beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. I find most religions facinating. I am always willing to hear peoples thoughts or beliefs in the topic of religion. I think everyone can learn from it. It gives people character.
I am very thankful to my mother for letting me choose my own path of religion and not forcing me to do something when I am old enough to know that I believe in and what I don't believe in. So I was born and raised a catholic but a christain by choice (for now anyways)
Sorry for such a long post...told ya I had many thoughts...the bad thing is this is just the begining of my thoughts lol
This is one topic I find hard to really explain what I feel and believe...but I will give it a try...maybe some of you can make sense of my many thoughts lol
I was born and raised a Catholic. Well not fully raised I guess. When I was really little I did go to church every saturday or sunday. But as me and my sister got older and we had our new baby brother my dad working rotating 12s my mom really just kinda fell out of taking a baby a four year old and a 6 year old to church once a week by herself.
Up through my sophmore year of high school I went to religon classes that were held before school started each morning leaving one day out of the week to go to church before school started. Once in high school my mom said that I can choose weather or not to go to religon. She thought I was old enough to pick what I wanted to believe in or do when it came to religion.
My mom was rasied from a very very very religious family (which might be way we aren't really practicing catholics to this day) I went to religion up through my sophmore year not really thrilled with the catholic church. I belive in a go and that Jesus was born and died on the cross to save us....but there are so many things I don't quite believe in and understand through the catholic church. While attend religion once a week through highschool I also attend a youth group through a local christain church. I learned and uderstoond things more in that year than I did over the last 10 years in my catholic religion classes.
To this day I go to church only a few times a year. I go for christmas eve mass and weddings and baptisms and for some other things. But other than that I really haven't been to church for the soul purpose of going to church.
Somethings I don't like about the Catholic Church:
The whole "tradition of it all"
the whole thing where we are the the most important religion and how we shun all others and how catholic are like royalty
I also don't understand why to confess your sins you must go to a priest once a month (if i do this i do it at home in my own prayers)
Why you must say "the hail mary" 10 times in a row before a our father on the rossary. There is this tradtion around her that people go to church early to pray the rossary before mass. Does this make you closer to god if you pray.
Durning school you were asked not to wear jeans to church. Now coming from a not so rich family compared to others Jeans is what I own...no skirts no dress that were "nice enough" (but now people can wear jeans to christmas mass and no one will say a word to ya about it.
If and when I pray I do it with meaning. Not to just pray not just because it's just they way it is. Not just because it is the churches tradition and has been for 300 years.
And old friend of mine and I once got in a fight about church. She thinks because she goes to church once a week. confesses all of her sins once a month to a priest makes her a better christain than I. I'm sorry but I don't believe that going to church and confessing all your sins to a priest one minute than going out that very same day and comitting all of those sins all over again is right. I know my sins I know that some things that I say or do is wrong in the "eyes of the lord" but I don't go preaching and praising that I am a good catholic and that I confess all my sins to god and then go out and do them all over again and not think twice about it.
See what I mean...I am very indifferent...I have my beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. I find most religions facinating. I am always willing to hear peoples thoughts or beliefs in the topic of religion. I think everyone can learn from it. It gives people character.
I am very thankful to my mother for letting me choose my own path of religion and not forcing me to do something when I am old enough to know that I believe in and what I don't believe in. So I was born and raised a catholic but a christain by choice (for now anyways)
Sorry for such a long post...told ya I had many thoughts...the bad thing is this is just the begining of my thoughts lol
NewMommy80107
New member
Well, I feel like the odd ball here. I'm Eastern Orthodox. I grew up going to church often...not every Sunday, but a lot of them. As a kid, I probably didn't understand much, I just did what I was told and went along with the traditions. I went to Sunday School and goofed off most of the time. It wasn't until college that I really began to understand what my religion was all about. I went to a Christian University and one of the requirements was that you take a few religion courses. None of the classes (or at least the one's I took) leaned toward one faith or another. They simply taught the history and basis of the beliefs. It was there that I learned the most about Orthodoxy. (I'm not going to get into it here because I don't want to seem like I'm preaching).
Anyway, I'm glad I learned about all kinds of religions in college. I found that I was very content with the one I was raised in. I never really found myself questioning my beliefs either. I just had faith in what I was taught, and that's worked for me.
Don't get me wrong...I'm no model Christian. I cheated on boyfriends in high school, had sex before marriage, and got knocked up before getting married (I had to confess to my priest face to face before receiving the sacrament of marriage and none of these warranted a slap on the wrist with a ruler, any hail mary's--whatever they are--or any other type of "punishment"). I don't go to church every Sunday and don't confess each week (it's not a requirement in my church). I do wear a cross everyday, and feel protected when I do. I have religious icons in my house above my front door and in my baby's room. My preist came to the hospital after I gave birth to bless me and the baby. I feel good when I receive communion. I plan on taking my baby to church often as a family and raising her the same way.
Something else I learned (while preparing for my first confession)...My priest actually gave me a pamphlet with some prayers on it and a, well, list of things one should confess. They were the usual big sins like murder and other of the 10 Commandments. But more importantly, most had to do with being a good person in general...to yourself and others. Isn't that what should be important? Regarless of religion or faith, or lack thereof, shouldn't we all just be good people to one another? I guess one could argue that you can be a good person without believing in God...they'd be right. For me, though, believing in God makes me feel good, safe, and proud that I have a bond with Him.
Anyway, I'm glad I learned about all kinds of religions in college. I found that I was very content with the one I was raised in. I never really found myself questioning my beliefs either. I just had faith in what I was taught, and that's worked for me.
Don't get me wrong...I'm no model Christian. I cheated on boyfriends in high school, had sex before marriage, and got knocked up before getting married (I had to confess to my priest face to face before receiving the sacrament of marriage and none of these warranted a slap on the wrist with a ruler, any hail mary's--whatever they are--or any other type of "punishment"). I don't go to church every Sunday and don't confess each week (it's not a requirement in my church). I do wear a cross everyday, and feel protected when I do. I have religious icons in my house above my front door and in my baby's room. My preist came to the hospital after I gave birth to bless me and the baby. I feel good when I receive communion. I plan on taking my baby to church often as a family and raising her the same way.
Something else I learned (while preparing for my first confession)...My priest actually gave me a pamphlet with some prayers on it and a, well, list of things one should confess. They were the usual big sins like murder and other of the 10 Commandments. But more importantly, most had to do with being a good person in general...to yourself and others. Isn't that what should be important? Regarless of religion or faith, or lack thereof, shouldn't we all just be good people to one another? I guess one could argue that you can be a good person without believing in God...they'd be right. For me, though, believing in God makes me feel good, safe, and proud that I have a bond with Him.
heh - I recall preparing for the Sacrament of Penance in the 2nd grade - I seriously think I was totally cynical then too - because I do remember thinking, this is just dumb, my sins should be between me and God -and not his stand-in and it seemed silly to me that we had to keep track of our sins so that we could confess them.
We used ot haveto go to confession once a month during the regular school year and weekly during Lent... thru grade 9 - when my family moved and i finally got to go to public school and gacve that up... I used to make up a laundry list of sins.
I lied to my mother 5 times.
I didn't do my homework 3 times
i fought with my sister umm 12 - no 2 times...
i always thought I should say I'm lying to you right now but that would have gotten me detention or a knuckle rap with the ruler or something.
NewMommy's got it right - it really was about being a good person and the golden rule - do unto others and you would have them do unto you... but in all the force feeding of stuff that was done and the prayers that we were forced to memorize (yes, i can stills ay the hail mary and the our father in the original latin) that the actual concepts were skipped over.
We used ot haveto go to confession once a month during the regular school year and weekly during Lent... thru grade 9 - when my family moved and i finally got to go to public school and gacve that up... I used to make up a laundry list of sins.
I lied to my mother 5 times.
I didn't do my homework 3 times
i fought with my sister umm 12 - no 2 times...
i always thought I should say I'm lying to you right now but that would have gotten me detention or a knuckle rap with the ruler or something.
NewMommy's got it right - it really was about being a good person and the golden rule - do unto others and you would have them do unto you... but in all the force feeding of stuff that was done and the prayers that we were forced to memorize (yes, i can stills ay the hail mary and the our father in the original latin) that the actual concepts were skipped over.
xorie
New member
Hmmm..
I'm Catholic at the moment, but I find myself not believing in some of the things that the Church believes in. Such as no gay/lesbian marriage, or no birth control and stuff like that. Also, I do know that there is a lot of corruption in the church, any church probably, and I sometimes wonder why I need to go to church...just to be saved? I try and live as Jesus did and be nice and use the golden rule, but does going to church every sunday mean anything? I pray at home, and I think about god, but the services are so boring, and the kneeling kills my knee sometimes. (I hurt it in vb a couple of years ago, and when I kneel on it just right, the pain is excruciating)
I find myself questioning some of the things that I grew up with and it's rather uncomfortable. The most that I can do about it is to pray and meditate on what my beliefs actually are. Hopefully I'll get an answer soon.
I'm Catholic at the moment, but I find myself not believing in some of the things that the Church believes in. Such as no gay/lesbian marriage, or no birth control and stuff like that. Also, I do know that there is a lot of corruption in the church, any church probably, and I sometimes wonder why I need to go to church...just to be saved? I try and live as Jesus did and be nice and use the golden rule, but does going to church every sunday mean anything? I pray at home, and I think about god, but the services are so boring, and the kneeling kills my knee sometimes. (I hurt it in vb a couple of years ago, and when I kneel on it just right, the pain is excruciating)
I find myself questioning some of the things that I grew up with and it's rather uncomfortable. The most that I can do about it is to pray and meditate on what my beliefs actually are. Hopefully I'll get an answer soon.
MasterofJune
New member
Very simple to me.
I look at this monitor as I type this message and know that it just did not appear one day. There was some sort of creation involved in this very sophisticated technology.
If you want to talk sophisticated, then the human body is probably the most sophisticated working organism on the planet. Our ability to learn, our ability to feel emotions and control our impulses is really quite amazing. Not to mention the digestive system or brain.
There had to be some form of creation along the line. Now whether or not it was some white haired dude sitting on a throne or not, I honestly don't know. The main thing here is that there was creation. We didn't end up here by accident.
I look at this monitor as I type this message and know that it just did not appear one day. There was some sort of creation involved in this very sophisticated technology.
If you want to talk sophisticated, then the human body is probably the most sophisticated working organism on the planet. Our ability to learn, our ability to feel emotions and control our impulses is really quite amazing. Not to mention the digestive system or brain.
There had to be some form of creation along the line. Now whether or not it was some white haired dude sitting on a throne or not, I honestly don't know. The main thing here is that there was creation. We didn't end up here by accident.
CrunkChipmunk
New member
I was raised protestant lutheran christian and became a fundamentalist christian I was so devout, but as I read the bible unlike most christians the questions kept on coming to me of how this or this or that could be justice from a god that was supposed to be perfect.
The bible says no one can come to god except through the name of JC.
That means Anne Frank and all the Jews of the holocaust and every other good and decent person the world has ever had who didn't accept JC before they died are now frying in hell.
Do they deserve that fate? According to JC and big daddy god thats an affirmative.
According to ol crunkchipmunk? Hell no they don't.
So in short I don't believe for many reasons most of which is that I've actually read the bible particularly leviticus and other not so nice bible books where raping women is promoted as is the killing of children.
The website Skeptics Annotated Bible goes into great length all the contradictions that shouldn't be in this perfect book created by this perfect god.
A thoughtful website that helped me on my journey to atheism is infidelguy.com its run by a nice guy named Reggie who has his own internet talk radio show and a huge forum full of skeptics and people he has helped lead away from religious mental enslavement of various sorts. It might be just the site for you Aleeluh.
A comedy site that is really great landover baptist.com makes fun of fundamentalist christians by using real teachings from the bible which makes it all the more hilarious.
The watchmaker argument is also really good at refuting the we're so unique argument we must of been created. (not a shot at you Dan, its just that many religious people bring it up)
Watchmaker analogy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Also I forgot the name of another argument christians use but it goes something like well its better to believe in the christian god just to be safe as when you die you want to go to heaven don't you? The problem with that argument is the person making it is assuming the christian god is the right god. Maybe in reality the real god that needs to be worshipped to go to paradise is Mithra or Apollo or Bob the raingod, etc.
Anyway sorry for being so long winded but yeah another thing I found is one of the only reasons I clung to christianity for so long is my fear of going to hell and thats one of the main ways christianity keeps its followers. That being with fear. Another way is finding someone thats just been through something emotionally traumatic and then welcoming them into the loving christian group to be freed from their emotional troubles by Jesus.
It sounds innocent on the surface but its not as that person was not in a rational state of mind to make a sound judgement on whether the religion was good for them or not. They just saw the group support and they needed some support and took it and then allow themselves to be brainwashed and the brainwashers are all too happy to do this. Its disgusting.
Another thing that sickens me is christians these days are having hot female christians go round up guys inviting them to pizza parties and these guys think the christian babes are actually into them so they go but when they arrive those girls are usually not there. What they end up getting is their pizza but also a bait and switch since the girls are not there and while they're eating a preacher stands up and starts telling them about Jesus.
Its absolutely ridiculous, pathetic and deceitful.
The bible says no one can come to god except through the name of JC.
That means Anne Frank and all the Jews of the holocaust and every other good and decent person the world has ever had who didn't accept JC before they died are now frying in hell.
Do they deserve that fate? According to JC and big daddy god thats an affirmative.
According to ol crunkchipmunk? Hell no they don't.
So in short I don't believe for many reasons most of which is that I've actually read the bible particularly leviticus and other not so nice bible books where raping women is promoted as is the killing of children.
The website Skeptics Annotated Bible goes into great length all the contradictions that shouldn't be in this perfect book created by this perfect god.
A thoughtful website that helped me on my journey to atheism is infidelguy.com its run by a nice guy named Reggie who has his own internet talk radio show and a huge forum full of skeptics and people he has helped lead away from religious mental enslavement of various sorts. It might be just the site for you Aleeluh.
A comedy site that is really great landover baptist.com makes fun of fundamentalist christians by using real teachings from the bible which makes it all the more hilarious.
The watchmaker argument is also really good at refuting the we're so unique argument we must of been created. (not a shot at you Dan, its just that many religious people bring it up)
Watchmaker analogy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Also I forgot the name of another argument christians use but it goes something like well its better to believe in the christian god just to be safe as when you die you want to go to heaven don't you? The problem with that argument is the person making it is assuming the christian god is the right god. Maybe in reality the real god that needs to be worshipped to go to paradise is Mithra or Apollo or Bob the raingod, etc.
Anyway sorry for being so long winded but yeah another thing I found is one of the only reasons I clung to christianity for so long is my fear of going to hell and thats one of the main ways christianity keeps its followers. That being with fear. Another way is finding someone thats just been through something emotionally traumatic and then welcoming them into the loving christian group to be freed from their emotional troubles by Jesus.
It sounds innocent on the surface but its not as that person was not in a rational state of mind to make a sound judgement on whether the religion was good for them or not. They just saw the group support and they needed some support and took it and then allow themselves to be brainwashed and the brainwashers are all too happy to do this. Its disgusting.
Another thing that sickens me is christians these days are having hot female christians go round up guys inviting them to pizza parties and these guys think the christian babes are actually into them so they go but when they arrive those girls are usually not there. What they end up getting is their pizza but also a bait and switch since the girls are not there and while they're eating a preacher stands up and starts telling them about Jesus.
Its absolutely ridiculous, pathetic and deceitful.
MasterofJune
New member
Looks like an interesting read there on Wiki. When I get time I will definitely read up on it. I actually heard that on the radio one night, and it has stuck with me. I don't take that as a shot, bro. I just have to know that we are here for a reason.
That is pathetic. It's a belief system in our society that you need sex to sell everything these days. Now they are doing that with Christianity. What really kills me is all of the "Christians" that hang out at abortion clinics and call the women whores and murderers as they go inside. Whether or not you are against or for abortion, that isn't right.
laurajj'smommy
New member
I believe in a great creator a loving being whose love and knowledge is too powerful and too great for us to understand and that it created and loves everything in and including the universe even though we do not all feel that way about one another. It loves the religous hypocrits as much as the spiritually seeking it loves the greedy and powerful as much as the giving and generous it loves us all everything and it understands about its creation what we do not. It loves and it loves and even though I do not know how it could love the people or things that seem to cause me pain or suffering it does and it loves me too even though i am not christ, an angel or a saint it loves me as much as it loves them and in turn i am not a child molester, an abuser, or a murderer but it loves them as much as it loves me it is greater than human love it loves all it is essential love in a pure unconditional form it just is................I am non denominational but if you consider what christ, budda, ghandi (for example) themselves spoke , lived, or taught the messages were love based it was human perception that twisted the faith not the maker or his messengers it was human nature and mankind that twisted up the world into "holy" wars and religous battles molesting priests and corrupt church evangelists are not god-given only love is and love is as love lives and does and I belive there is always a greater love in existence than the power of love that I know now (that being human love) there is it is it just is..............
bikinibound
New member
Hey !
My boyfriend is Christian and his family go to church every Sunday, naturally we have been too a few times but i always feel kind of awkward when im there. Its not that i feel like i don't belong, but just that i don't KNOW my exact beliefs so maybe i shouldn't be praying and such until i do. I used to attend a private school when i was young and we'd attend a small church service every Tuesday, i was very young so don't remember much but that was only church going phase in life really. We live an hour from my boyfriends parents so don't attend church weekly with them, and were normally too busy to go in this town.
As for MY beliefs? well. im very confused. i Believe in god, i love to think there's someone up there watching over all of us who has some kind of plan, the idea of us humans being all alone is scary. So yes i believe in god. I however take a sort of scientific approach on the rest, like some of the 'miracles' i question, and the authenticity of the stories in the bible i dont feel comfortable quoting as fact. For these reasons it upsets me when people make me feel bad about my life choices, when they live their lives by this book. People who don't believe in tattoos, sex before marriage and such. There has only been one person to actually say something to me about this, but when i walk into church i just feel glares and that people are looking down upon me.
There has been time when ive been so overcome by church and close to tears when people have been reading from sermons, but other times when i feel so awkward because i feel like the only one whose belief isint set in stone.
yeah, America is a weird place for religion--especially in the South and Midwest--Bible thumpers coming out of the woodwork!! I think it's terrible that the people in the church made you feel uncomfortable. A few quotes from the Bible come to mind: "Judge not, lest ye be judged" "Ye who is without sin cast the first stone." Personally, I find that a lot of the Bible thumpers tend to be hypocritical. For example: booze and cigarettes are taboo, but it's ok to gorge oneself with donuts. My parents go to a Baptist church, and it is filled with fat people--including the pastor. Clearly they feel that eating in excess is ok. But I know for a fact that they think that having an occasional glass of wine is just pure evil. Personally, I think that anything in excess is probably not good. All things in moderation--including tattoos..
I mean, honestly--how many of them were virgins at marriage? I would refuse to go to a church like that. There are plenty of churches that are more tolerant. 
Lagniappe
New member
I'm an atheist. Didn't have a terribly religious background, but my family was active in their church (Methodist) and trotted us off to church every Sunday dressed in our best clothing and shiny shoes. I never considered myself a heathen, but didn't really give it a lot of thought either way until I went to college. I took a class on comparative religion, and that really clenched it for me. Christianity borrowed so much of its mythology from the earlier "pagan" religions... it just didn't stand up to scrutiny. To me, it makes no sense to believe in the traditional concept of "God" (ie, a being that created us, cares about our football games, has a "plan" for us, etc.) Some people say that god is "love" or god is some inexplicable "force" -- I can accept that kind of theory much more easily than the notion of an authoritarian god that creates humans only to torture them for not living up to his expectations. All that dogma... no thanks. If god is "love" or some benign "force" -- then what is there to worship? It would be nice to believe in all of that, but it makes no sense to me, so I can't. Instead, my aim is to be the best person I can be, to be kind, to be fair, and to be a good citizen of the world. I don't think that god enters into that. My moral compass doesn't point to heaven or hell.
When religious types give me grief about being a nonbeliever (which happens rarely, but sometimes), I just point out to them that they are also atheist when it comes to Zeus, Odin, Thor, Poseidon, Pele, Krishna, etc. I just believe in one less god than they do.
If you're interested in this topic, you might check out an atheist forum. There are several, and all would welcome you even if you are just inquiring and not decided.
When religious types give me grief about being a nonbeliever (which happens rarely, but sometimes), I just point out to them that they are also atheist when it comes to Zeus, Odin, Thor, Poseidon, Pele, Krishna, etc. I just believe in one less god than they do.
If you're interested in this topic, you might check out an atheist forum. There are several, and all would welcome you even if you are just inquiring and not decided.
raekicksboys
New member
Pronoun game!
Interesting discussion, very nice. Again, no offense intended. Sorry if this gets too personal, but this discussion is, so why not?
I wasn't raised in any church and I've only ever attended services for funerals. My mom was raised Pentacostal, but religion wasn't forced on me at any point while I grew up. I was raised with all the good morals and all that, just without the blind faith and force-feeding of someone else's beliefs. I couldn't tell you whether or not this changed me in some substantial way; part of me believes that I'd be totally different if she'd put me through that as a kid. To be quite honest, I think I would have severe emotional issues due to the fact that I'm attracted to women. You know, conflict with who I am versus who God (the church?) would prefer me to be. There for awhile I did have problems dealing with it, part of the coming out process, I guess. Nobody wants to spit in the face of God, well, okay, I didn't. Some of you might like to or have, but hellfire and damnation, all that was pretty scary when I was young.
I've found myself wanting to believe in something, some higher power over the past few years, since coming out to my mother Sept 9th, 2001 (great timing, right?). I do believe in a higher power, not sure what else to call him/her but God so that works for me. I'm also a firm believer in Karma. I try to be a good person, be compassionate, thoughtful, considerate, caring, and kind--I do have my vices, though. I think all of that helps me get closer to God--Minus the vices, well, a few of them might help, too.
I do not believe God has a hand in our lives on a daily basis, I think he/she just lets things happen on their own. We're here and he/she's a silent observer, stepping in only when necessary which may not be when we all feel it's necessary, but again big cosmic plan and we don't know all the parts to it. A big part of me believes all religions are formed from the same idea and the same guy/gal's behind it and all of them were custom-made for that specific demographic. I also prefer a different type of prayer. My form of prayer is just me talking outloud, speaking my mind when no one else is around, like having a one-sided conversation with God while he/she just listens to my thoughts, fears, hopes, and rants. Giving voice to my thoughts has allowed me to understand myself better. Not everyone's into 6 hour long masses, worshipping cows, or going to temple 5 times a day, you know? God wants as many of us to visit him/her as possible after this life and before the next so he/she had to fine-tune all these little sects. I'm sure he/she's pissed at all the terrible things done in his/her name, though. I'd be.
I guess I just never liked the idea of a vengeful angry God. I also don't believe some book of fairytales is the word of God. I don't need a book written by dead guys who made up stuff as they went--and changed things they didn't like over the past however many centuries (millennia?) to dictate how I'm supposed to treat my slaves, how I should act as a woman, or what meat I can eat on which day of the week. Furthermore, I find it hard to believe that some all-knowing, all-seeing entity would have such silly human reactions to what we do. Wtf kinda God is gonna have a tantrum and destroy a city? I'd imagine he/she's very sage-like, like an old Kung Fu master, just an aura of wisdom and a well of knowledge and understanding, with a killer sense of humor. I still think God laughs when the wind catches papers we've dropped, when we run out of toilet paper, when we fall down (but only if we don't injure ourselves in the process), or when we rip one. We're like an ant farm, just much more interesting and entertaining. I'd like to believe in a loving God who accepts us as we are as long as we try our best to do good things and bring tolerance and even love into the world. God would only want the best for us, we just have to make that kinda thing happen 'cause God's only watching, not actively participating.
Pennies, 2 of them.
Interesting discussion, very nice. Again, no offense intended. Sorry if this gets too personal, but this discussion is, so why not?
I wasn't raised in any church and I've only ever attended services for funerals. My mom was raised Pentacostal, but religion wasn't forced on me at any point while I grew up. I was raised with all the good morals and all that, just without the blind faith and force-feeding of someone else's beliefs. I couldn't tell you whether or not this changed me in some substantial way; part of me believes that I'd be totally different if she'd put me through that as a kid. To be quite honest, I think I would have severe emotional issues due to the fact that I'm attracted to women. You know, conflict with who I am versus who God (the church?) would prefer me to be. There for awhile I did have problems dealing with it, part of the coming out process, I guess. Nobody wants to spit in the face of God, well, okay, I didn't. Some of you might like to or have, but hellfire and damnation, all that was pretty scary when I was young.
I've found myself wanting to believe in something, some higher power over the past few years, since coming out to my mother Sept 9th, 2001 (great timing, right?). I do believe in a higher power, not sure what else to call him/her but God so that works for me. I'm also a firm believer in Karma. I try to be a good person, be compassionate, thoughtful, considerate, caring, and kind--I do have my vices, though.
I think all of that helps me get closer to God--Minus the vices, well, a few of them might help, too. I do not believe God has a hand in our lives on a daily basis, I think he/she just lets things happen on their own. We're here and he/she's a silent observer, stepping in only when necessary which may not be when we all feel it's necessary, but again big cosmic plan and we don't know all the parts to it. A big part of me believes all religions are formed from the same idea and the same guy/gal's behind it and all of them were custom-made for that specific demographic. I also prefer a different type of prayer. My form of prayer is just me talking outloud, speaking my mind when no one else is around, like having a one-sided conversation with God while he/she just listens to my thoughts, fears, hopes, and rants. Giving voice to my thoughts has allowed me to understand myself better. Not everyone's into 6 hour long masses, worshipping cows, or going to temple 5 times a day, you know? God wants as many of us to visit him/her as possible after this life and before the next so he/she had to fine-tune all these little sects. I'm sure he/she's pissed at all the terrible things done in his/her name, though. I'd be.
I guess I just never liked the idea of a vengeful angry God. I also don't believe some book of fairytales is the word of God. I don't need a book written by dead guys who made up stuff as they went--and changed things they didn't like over the past however many centuries (millennia?) to dictate how I'm supposed to treat my slaves, how I should act as a woman, or what meat I can eat on which day of the week. Furthermore, I find it hard to believe that some all-knowing, all-seeing entity would have such silly human reactions to what we do. Wtf kinda God is gonna have a tantrum and destroy a city? I'd imagine he/she's very sage-like, like an old Kung Fu master, just an aura of wisdom and a well of knowledge and understanding, with a killer sense of humor. I still think God laughs when the wind catches papers we've dropped, when we run out of toilet paper, when we fall down (but only if we don't injure ourselves in the process), or when we rip one. We're like an ant farm, just much more interesting and entertaining. I'd like to believe in a loving God who accepts us as we are as long as we try our best to do good things and bring tolerance and even love into the world. God would only want the best for us, we just have to make that kinda thing happen 'cause God's only watching, not actively participating.
Pennies, 2 of them.