Weight lifting: lift fast or slow for more efficient fat loss

[txsqlchick]

OK, trying to bring this thread back to reality...

My brother and I both lift weights, but we have very different fitness goals.

His goal is to "bulk up" and get "bigger". He doesn't want big muscles, but he wants his muscles to be bigger. He is tall and pretty lean naturally.

My goal is to preserve or increase lean muscle mass and create "definition" but not "bulk" and also to be stronger overall.

He goes to the gym and lifts weights; I don't know the specifics of his routine and diet but so far, it is not working for him. We do not live or work close to each other so we don't go to the gym together.

I go to the gym and use both free weights and machines, focusing on one or two specific areas at a time (one day I focus on chest & shoulders, another day I focus on arms & back, another day I focus on legs & butt, etc). Once a week I take a 50-minute "lift" class where we do a lot of reps but we cycle through them, lifting the weight for 3 counts and lowering it in 1, then lifting it for 2 counts and lowering it in 2, then lifting it in 1 count and lowering it for 3, etc. I find this class very challenging but I can usually keep up in reps, though I have to use lighter weights than I normally use at the gym if I'm lifting by myself. The class works arms, shoulders, chest, back, thighs, butt, etc. I couldn't name each lift that we do, I don't know the names for them. I'm also usually sore for 2-3 days after I do this class.

Basically my questions are this...is my routine going to help me achieve my goals, and if not, what can I do differently? Also, what advice can I give my brother? He sees my success with weight loss and assumes that I know more about fitness than I actually do; I don't want to give him advice myself because I honestly don't know the answers to his questions.

Thanks.

 

[Steve]

OK, trying to bring this thread back to reality...

Back to reality?

The discussion has been based solely on the title of this thread. What's fake about it?

He doesn't want big muscles, but he wants his muscles to be bigger

.

He should rid any notion he has in his mind about getting too big for his liking.

It's not going to happen.

My goal is to preserve or increase lean muscle mass and create "definition" but not "bulk" and also to be stronger overall.

I suspect there are light misconceptions backing this statement.

You don't tone.

A muscle either grows or it doesn't. It's really that simple.

Maybe I'm reading you wrong, and if that's the case... I apologize.

He goes to the gym and lifts weights; I don't know the specifics of his routine and diet but so far, it is not working for him.

I would need a ton of information beyond what you've provided if I were going to help him. But if you mean it's not working in the sense that his muscles aren't getting bigger, my guess would be:

1. He's not eating enough

2. He's not focusing on progressive overload

3. He's not consistent enough

In that order.

I go to the gym and use both free weights and machines, focusing on one or two specific areas at a time (one day I focus on chest & shoulders, another day I focus on arms & back, another day I focus on legs & butt, etc).

I'm not a fan of body part splits like this for various reasons. What made you go with something like this?

Once a week I take a 50-minute "lift" class where we do a lot of reps but we cycle through them, lifting the weight for 3 counts and lowering it in 1, then lifting it for 2 counts and lowering it in 2, then lifting it in 1 count and lowering it for 3, etc. I find this class very challenging but I can usually keep up in reps, though I have to use lighter weights than I normally use at the gym if I'm lifting by myself.

This is a hybrid of cardio and weight training.

It's in place predominantly for calorie expenditure.

Basically my questions are this...is my routine going to help me achieve my goals, and if not, what can I do differently?

Your goal from what I gather is to preserve muscle while losing fat. Your resistance training routine could definitely stand some change but sure, it will help you maintain muscle... assuming you're eating adequate amounts of protein too.

If I were you, I'd focus on a full body routine instead which would give your muscles exposure to stress more frequently.

Also, what advice can I give my brother?

See above.

 

[Doc Bunkum]

His goal is to "bulk up" and get "bigger". He doesn't want big muscles, but he wants his muscles to be bigger.

Say what?

That's an oxymoron if I've ever heard one.

 

[txsqlchick]

Say what?

That's an oxymoron if I've ever heard one.

You'd have to take it up with him; that is an exact quote.

 

[Steve]

I was going to say the same thing, Doc, lol.

But I'm assuming he's one of those skinny guys who for whatever reason believes getting to look like arnold is simple so although he wants somewhat larger musculature, he doesn't want to be huge.

 

[txsqlchick]

I was going to say the same thing, Doc, lol.

But I'm assuming he's one of those skinny guys who for whatever reason believes getting to look like arnold is simple so although he wants somewhat larger musculature, he doesn't want to be huge.

Yeah, that's kind of what he thinks. He's an MBA, he doesn't know shit about fitness. And I know only slightly less than shit, so I don't want to tell him what he should/should not be doing.

 

[Steve]

Well I'd put money on his problem coming from one of the three things I mentioned above.

 

[txsqlchick]

Well I'd put money on his problem coming from one of the three things I mentioned above.

I think I will tell him to find a personal trainer.

As for me focusing on different areas of the body each day...when I first started working out, I'd get sore all over if I lifted all over. This way I could restrict the soreness to one area. Made sense at the time!

 

[maleficent]

about a year ago - one of the diet/fitness books of the moment (probably pimped by Oprah) was the 12 second sequence by Jorge Cruise (the same guy who developed the 3 hour diet

His weight lifting concept was that every movement should be 10 seconds up - hold for 2 then 10 seconds down - his theory was that it took momentum out of the picture and forced muscles to do all the work...

 

[Steve]

I think I will tell him to find a personal trainer.

Careful with that... many trainers are horrible. There are some good ones and you might try searching the forums using the key word "personal trainer" or something to find threads regarding how best go about picking one.

As for me focusing on different areas of the body each day...when I first started working out, I'd get sore all over if I lifted all over. This way I could restrict the soreness to one area. Made sense at the time!

I wouldn't let the prospect of soreness be the determining factor of how frequently you train various body parts. Like I said, if I were you I'd be doing something like a full body routine 2-3 times per week.

 

[Steve]

about a year ago - one of the diet/fitness books of the moment (probably pimped by Oprah) was the 12 second sequence by Jorge Cruise (the same guy who developed the 3 hour diet

His weight lifting concept was that every movement should be 10 seconds up - hold for 2 then 10 seconds down - his theory was that it took momentum out of the picture and forced muscles to do all the work...

He's an idiot.

 

[Doc Bunkum]

about a year ago - one of the diet/fitness books of the moment (probably pimped by Oprah) was the 12 second sequence by Jorge Cruise (the same guy who developed the 3 hour diet

Tough call on this one to seperate fact from fiction.

The best way I've found to get a general feel for a book when you're not sure is to go to Amazon and read the reviews.

You can usually pick up something that you overlooked.

Now I haven't read his book, but one reviewer that did passes on this gem from Jorge that apparently is in the book:

"When you add five pounds of lean muscle tissue to your body with the incredibly effective 12-Second Sequence(tm) workouts , you increase your calories burned each day by 250--that's 1,750 more calories burned each week!"

That should set off your bullshit meter alarms.

Contrast that to a quote by an actual exercise physiologist in a New York Times article by Gina Kolata:

"Jack Wilmore, an exercise physiologist at Texas A & M University, calculated that the average amount of muscle that men gained after a serious 12-week weight-lifting program was 2 kilograms, or 4.4 pounds. That added muscle would increase the metabolic rate by only 24 calories a day.

The muscle you gain is minuscule compared with the total amount of skeletal muscle in the body. And muscle has a very low metabolic rate when it's at rest. (You can't flex your biceps all the time.)"

Quite a difference and more in tune with what I've read.

And by the way, Jorge, 10 seconds up - hold for 2 then 10 seconds down, is 22 seconds - not 12 seconds.

Seem to be having a little trouble with numbers there, bud?

 

[maleficent]

he's a celebrity trainer -he's got accountants to count hismoney -that's all he needs

 

[Michelley85]

it's best to control the eccentric portion of the rep and lift the concentric portion as fast as possible.

This might mean a 2-3 second eccentric and a 1 second concentric.

Ok, but it doesn't really matter is what I'm getting from this thread?

I'm always curious about this though when I am lifting.

How important is it the rest (60-90 secs) after a set of reps? I follow a list of weights that I do and I'm "technically" suppose to rest after certain sets, but I tend to skip over it and/or not rest as long so I can get through the workout faster and also keep my heart pumping. I know it's important that your muscles are getting as much oxygen as possible, especially while lifting, but this shouldn't be doing me any harm or hinderance do ya think?

 

[Steve]

Ok, but it doesn't really matter is what I'm getting from this thread?

It does IMO. Which is why I said what I said.

How important is it the rest (60-90 secs) after a set of reps?

Completely depends on what net effect you're looking to get from your weight training. There isn't one way of going about things. There's only a way of going about things that ellicits a specific adaptation (improvment in specific quality).

For instance, if I was training for max strength in 3 lifts... I'm not going to sacrifice the amount of weight I can lift by taking short rest periods. I might rest 3-5 minutes between sets.

If I'm training primarily for caloric expenditure to aid a deficit, I might do a form of circuit training where I'm resting little to none between sets of various exercises.

I follow a list of weights that I do and I'm "technically" suppose to rest after certain sets, but I tend to skip over it and/or not rest as long so I can get through the workout faster and also keep my heart pumping.

And if you're lifting for a cardiovascular benefit, that makes sense.

If you're confusing what weight lifting for muscle and strength improvements feels like with what cardio feels like, you're making a mistake.

I know it's important that your muscles are getting as much oxygen as possible, especially while lifting, but this shouldn't be doing me any harm or hinderance do ya think?

Depends on your goals and what you're hoping to get from weight lifting. Not all weight lifting is created equal. Also, no way is better than another way without providing context. Which you didn't.

 

[Michelley85]

If I'm training primarily for caloric expenditure to aid a deficit, I might do a form of circuit training where I'm resting little to none between sets of various exercises.

Makes sense.

If you're confusing what weight lifting for muscle and strength improvements feels like with what cardio feels like, you're making a mistake.

I might be doing that, I haven't really thought about it like that before. I guess I'm not really educated enough in the strength training aspect of my workout.

The reason why I am doing the strength training is to aid in my weight loss.

Which you didn't.

I suck? I was trying to ask a question and I can't even do that right!! haha.

Also, I hate context and wish you could just read my mind.

 

[Steve]

All people has different body reaction toward something...Sometime we can do some activities without stop, but at different times we have to make a stop.

I don't have a clue what this means but adaptation to stress is pretty universal. Might want to do some research on GAS and Hans Seyle.

 

[Steve]

I might be doing that, I haven't really thought about it like that before. I guess I'm not really educated enough in the strength training aspect of my workout.

Well something is better than nothing assuming you're not doing something that's going to hurt you. And you have to start someplace. Trust me, most people are completely confused when it comes to this stuff. And it doesn't surprise me with all the bogus information that's passed around these days.

So I wouldn't beat yourself up at all. Simply work at having a better understanding.

The reason why I am doing the strength training is to aid in my weight loss.

Aid in what sense though? Weight training, like I sad previously, can aid in weight loss by expending a lot of calories using low weight, high rep, short rest types of lifting.

Or weight training can aid in weight loss by promoting muscle maintenance while fat is being loss, thus optimizing body composition. This is where many people miss the boat and it's discussed in detail in that thread I linked for you.

I suck? I was trying to ask a question and I can't even do that right!! haha.

You're doing just fine.

Also, I hate context and wish you could just read my mind.

I almost can. I'm just trying to get you to think.

 

[Michelley85]

Thank you!

Aid in what sense though? Weight training, like I sad previously, can aid in weight loss by expending a lot of calories using low weight, high rep, short rest types of lifting.

That sounds cool.

Or weight training can aid in weight loss by promoting muscle maintenance while fat is being loss, thus optimizing body composition. This is where many people miss the boat and it's discussed in detail in that thread I linked for you.

That sounds WAY COOLER! That's exactly what I was going for!!

I'm just trying to get you to think.

Freak, I knew it you dirty bastard. lol

 

[Steve]

Thank you!

Read that and if you still have questions feel free to ask them there or here.