Weight-Loss "Negative calorie" foods as snacks...

Weight-Loss
mccormack090305

mccormack090305

New member
Okay, I've read a lot on the subject, but I can't make up my mind on where the truth lies.

If anyone has read my other posts in "The Club", you know that I was eating A LOT, like, tons more food than anyone should eat, and it was all junk. I changed my diet on Sunday, trying desperately to reduce my intake and eat healthier. I would seriously have a pizza everyday, if not 2 pizzas, a case of Pepsi, candy, pop-tarts, greasy cheeseburgers, you name it. If it's bad for you, I was eating it, and in such quantities that I can't believe I'm still alive.

Anyways, with the new program I'm trying to stick to, I keep finding myself very hungry between meals. I can't stand the taste of vegetables, though I eat about a cup of them with each meal, or at least I try to. What I'm trying to figure out is whether or not I can assume that, if it's a fruit or vegetable, I can have as much of it as I want (within reason) to keep from being hungry.

I tend to think that I can probably snack on any fruits or veggies I want without much concern for the calories in them, because I lose more calories eating them than what they had in the first place, but this sounds too good to be true. I'm also worried about the sugars in the fruits, such as oranges.

I've searched the forums, but I can't seem to find the answer I'm looking for. Can someone shed some light on this?
 
mccormack090305 said:
Okay, I've read a lot on the subject, but I can't make up my mind on where the truth lies.

If anyone has read my other posts in "The Club", you know that I was eating A LOT, like, tons more food than anyone should eat, and it was all junk. I changed my diet on Sunday, trying desperately to reduce my intake and eat healthier. I would seriously have a pizza everyday, if not 2 pizzas, a case of Pepsi, candy, pop-tarts, greasy cheeseburgers, you name it. If it's bad for you, I was eating it, and in such quantities that I can't believe I'm still alive.

Anyways, with the new program I'm trying to stick to,
Click to expand...

Before getting to your question, let me ask you this...

Are you making drastic changes overnight? If so, how sustainable do you feel these changes are? Might more subtle, gradual changes become ingrained better?

I only ask these questions b/c it sounds like, and I could be wrong, that you've moving from one extreme to another and if history tells us anything, it's that this sort of abrupt change, especially in the world of fat loss, is temporary.

Just something to think about.

I keep finding myself very hungry between meals. I can't stand the taste of vegetables, though I eat about a cup of them with each meal, or at least I try to. What I'm trying to figure out is whether or not I can assume that, if it's a fruit or vegetable, I can have as much of it as I want (within reason) to keep from being hungry.

I tend to think that I can probably snack on any fruits or veggies I want without much concern for the calories in them, because I lose more calories eating them than what they had in the first place, but this sounds too good to be true. I'm also worried about the sugars in the fruits, such as oranges.

I've searched the forums, but I can't seem to find the answer I'm looking for. Can someone shed some light on this?
Click to expand...

Negative calorie foods don't exist. If they did, it would mean you could eat virtually limitless amounts of them and never gain weight. That's not the case.

Fibrous veggies, for instance, certainly are calorically-sparse. They're also water-dense and fiber-dense. These factors work to satiate you more than most foods. Our bodies tend to register volume of food more so than it does energy (calorie) density of food.

Knowing this, the big idea, at least one of them, is to choose foods that aren't energy-dense thus providing less energy per given volume.

The energy balance equation still applies - eat more energy than your body needs in given period of time and you'll add tissue (gain weight). It's just much more difficult to out-eat your body's needs when a large foundation of your diet is built with foods that are very low in calories and high in fiber and water, like fibrous veggies.

Of course there are other important matters when it comes to food selection too. But that's not what you're asking.
 
I think you are thinking of the myth of the Celery diet..that it takes more energy to eat and burn celery than the calorie count.


As Steve said, that's is a myth. Do what he said above :)
 
I struggle with deciding about what to do about eating between meals also. I have tried just about ALL types of small healthy snacks, but oddly enough, it seems like in an hour or so, I am almost hungrier than if I hadn't had the snack at all. Anyone have that happen? It's almost like the small amount of food stimulated my hunger more. I am starting to feel like it's better to have a little more food at my main meal, and just wait it out. The stretch between lunch and dinner is my problem hour, then sometimes before bed. Often the hunger will wave in and out and if I keep busy I can ignore it. But I think you have to make sure you don't wait more than 5 hours between meals, or you are going to need a little something. I think adding the really low calorie vegetables TO your meal, really helps keep you fuller. But by themselves, they don't provide enough energy for a snack, I've had better luck with a handful of nuts or a couple slices of cheese, but those calories add up, that's why I am wondering if it's just better NOT to snack and eat a better meal??
 
Everyone is different. If you find it hard to snack and not want alot more, then don't snack. Increase at meals. Listen to your body.
 
It's different for everyone. I know people who successfully fast 16 hours per day and eat during the remaining 8 hours. It's the whole Intermittent Fasting (IF) approach and it works very, very well for some. They claim it controls their hunger, improves partitioning (where calories are going and coming from), fits their lifestyles better, etc.

But obviously that would not be for everyone.

It's a very individual thing and it requires trial and error to find what fits YOU best.

A couple of random thoughts include:

1. Decipher between true physiological hunger and non-physiological hunger. Physiological hunger is that which is triggered by the body - hormonal fluctuations, empty stomach, etc. Non-physiological hunger is that which is triggered by your environment - boredom, triggers (commercials, company, etc), food availability, etc. If it's the former, we should be focusing more on meal frequency, dietary composition, etc. If it's the latter, we should be focusing more on tweaking our environments. Typically it's a combination that's skewed to one side or the other.

2. Adequate protein consumption makes a world of difference. It's the most satiating nutrient we have at our disposal. If you're truly eating roughly 1 gram per pound of lean body mass... especially if this is coming from whole foods... it becomes increasingly hard to BE hungry.

3. As I noted above, volume of food matters. Our bodies acclimate to food volume. By this, I mean if we're used to eating food in the amount of the size of our fist ever 3 hours and we cut that volume in half, our bodies are going to let us know by way of sending hunger signals (primarily via stomach size). So it is evident that not only is caloric control important... so is volume control and that's where energy density comes into play. Paying particular attention to foods that provides the biggest bang for your buck in terms of volume without a huge caloric punch makes a difference. No, veggies aren't the be all end all fix. But they fit this category of foods nicely and their just one piece of the puzzle.

4. Fruit is a bit more energy dense than veggies but it's typically less energy dense than the foods typically seen in the American diet. In addition to providing volume without a terribly high caloric "punch," it also does some nifty things in terms of liver glycogen, which, in its own right is a method of squashing some of the hunger signaling.

5. As noted above, eating adequate fiber also plays a role via slowing down digestion thus leaving you fuller longer. Plus, high fiber foods tend to be low on the energy-density scale so it's a double whammy.

These lean more towards physiological hunger. Non-physiological hunger is too individual and complex to discuss in one post like this. But hopefully some of these points make a difference for you.
 
Steve, that is very interesting what you said about the fasting, that it controls hunger in some people. I wonder if that is why I feel better skipping snacks, that it somehow eventually regulates the hunger, whereas adding more foods tells the body to keep eating? Hmmmm...well I am no scientist, but that makes sense. Thanks
 
Thanks for the replies, guys!

Steve, I acknowledge that I do feel hungry due to boredom sometimes, but when I feel that way, I find something to do rather than eat. I'm only talking about when i physically feel my stomach telling me it needs something, lol.

As far as doing this all overnight, I did make a huge change in one day, but I leave it open to help myself along. I feel that it will be very sustainable, because I still can eat a lot of the things I liked before, but I essentially cut out all the crap, and I'm trying to replace the crap with fruits and vegetables.

Where before, I would eat a couple of packs of pop-tarts after my 4 cups of cereal in the morning, now I eat a grapefruit after my 1 cup of oatmeal (made with water) and 4oz. of lean turkey sausage. I get hungry sooner, but that's why I'm looking for healthy snack alternatives. I threw out all the junk I had in my house, and I'm going shopping today for my food for the next couple of weeks.

I guess I should post what my basic program is that I'm trying to stick to. That might help me if I can get suggestions on what I might be doing wrong or right. Let me go type it up fast, I'll post it in a few...
 
Okay, here is my "Plan". I'm not following this religiously, but I feel that it's a good starting point, and it's definitely a step in the right direction for me. I still eat whole wheat breads occasionally, even though it's not on there, and I eat more fruit than what it tells me to, but I have been consistently doing around 1500-1800 calories a day since I started this on Sunday, and my weight trend already seems to be going down...


BREAKFAST: 2 oz. either Protein A or B
1/2 cup either Carb A or B

AM SNACK: 2 oz. either Protein A or B
1/2 cup either Fruit A or B

LUNCH: 2 oz. either Protein A, B or C
1/2 cup either Carb A or B
1 cup Veggies

PM SNACK 2 oz. either Protein A or B
1/2 cup either Fruit A or B

SUPPER: 2 oz. either Protein A, B or C
1/2 cup either Carb A or B
1-2 cup Veggies

NIGHT SNACK: (Optional...if you are a late night person, have it, if you are early to bed, skip it)
2 oz. either Protein A, B or C
1/2 cup either Fruit A or B

TIPS: *Drink 100 oz. water per day
*No salt
*No sugar...use Splenda
*Use spices...no sodium

**For MEN: Replace 2 oz. Protein with 4 oz.
Replace 1/2 cup Carb with 1 cup



Protein A: Egg Whites
Fish (cod, flounder, haddock, orange roughy, red snapper)
Fish Steak (halibut, mahi mahi, tuna, shark

Protein B: Chicken Breast
Crab/Lobster
Scallops
Shrimp
Turkey Breast

Protein C: Beef (eye of round, sirloin steak, ground 93% lean)
Pork (lean chop, lean tenderloin)


Carb A: Jicama
Parsnips/Turnips
Potato
Rutabegas
Squash (acorn, banana, butternut, spaghetti)
Yams/Sweet Potatoes

Carb B: Barley
Millet
Oatmeal
Rice (white or brown)
Rice Noodles


Fruit A: Grapefruit
Mixed Berries (raspberries, blueberries, blackberries)
Peaches
Pineapple
Strawberries

Fruit B: Bananas
Apples
Canteloupe
Honeydew
Papaya
Pears
Plums


Veggies: Artochokes
Asparagus
Beets
Bell Peppers
Bok Choi
Broccoli
Brussel Sprouts
Cabbage
Carrots
Cauiflower
Celery
Cucumbers
Egg Plant
Green Beans/String Beans
Greens (mustard, collard, turnip)
Lettuce
Mushrooms
Snow Peas
Spinach
Sprouts
Summer Squash/Zuccini
Tomatoes/Sauce
 
Depending on some other factors on how you are, some of the following might help, since there are a few similarities between us. Exception is, I like veggies, esp raw.

Looking back on the past few month when I take everything into account, most of the times I've had what I call 'out of schedule hunger' is usually more that I'm thirsty.

I smoke and have an oral fixation. chew gum. Once they invent steak flavored gum, I'll be a happy man.

I've noticed the tendency for watery type foods & veggies to fill me up faster and for longer. Celery is like that, esp if stored in water to keep it crisp. I've been tending to keep a container of it around figuring hey, if I'm going to nosh, I can nosh on that, get my chew on and have a lot less impact than a cheeseburger.

Water and fiber filled veggies do tend to keep me fuller, I just have to watch out the next day, since after eating the equivalent of a wicker swing set worth of fiber, the phrase "This too shall pass" becomes interesting.

Figure out what you don't like about the taste and see what you can do to work around it. I didn't like them much as a kid mostly because I realized later, my parents used to boil the living hell out of them, so the flavor and texture was almost completely gone. Mostly I think this was their excuse to load it with salt and butter. Preparation can mean a lot.

Dill actually works well in place of butter in most cases amazingly enough if its just taste you're looking for. I'm sprinkling that stuff all over everything at times just before eating it.
 
mccormack090305 said:
Thanks for the replies, guys!

Steve, I acknowledge that I do feel hungry due to boredom sometimes, but when I feel that way, I find something to do rather than eat. I'm only talking about when i physically feel my stomach telling me it needs something, lol.

As far as doing this all overnight, I did make a huge change in one day, but I leave it open to help myself along. I feel that it will be very sustainable, because I still can eat a lot of the things I liked before, but I essentially cut out all the crap, and I'm trying to replace the crap with fruits and vegetables.

Where before, I would eat a couple of packs of pop-tarts after my 4 cups of cereal in the morning, now I eat a grapefruit after my 1 cup of oatmeal (made with water) and 4oz. of lean turkey sausage. I get hungry sooner, but that's why I'm looking for healthy snack alternatives. I threw out all the junk I had in my house, and I'm going shopping today for my food for the next couple of weeks.

I guess I should post what my basic program is that I'm trying to stick to. That might help me if I can get suggestions on what I might be doing wrong or right. Let me go type it up fast, I'll post it in a few...
Click to expand...

If I feel I'm ridiculously hungry.. I eat a small spoonfull of peanutbutter and drink some water.. Usually my hunger goes away or is at the very least more managable. Another thing.. If you're anything like me, and have a desk job.. I find that I'm hungrier while I'm at work than when I'm at home.. probably because I'm just sitting stationary and my mind is playing evil tricks on me. So not only do I keep a jar of peanut butter at my desk, but some chewing gum as well, to help me fend off times when I want to eat but I'm not really hungry. :) Maybe you can use these suggestions to help in your quest for weight loss.
 
It's interesting that you guys are pointing me to peanut butter, because that's one of the things I decided I can "fudge" in my diet. I feel as though it's a good fat, and in the small doses that I use it, the cons are negligible. I made a good low cal snack today that seemed to help me a lot. I took a plain Quaker rice cake and put a spoonful of peanut butter on it, then I diced up some banana over that. It was actually very filling and quite good.

Oatmeal is also a staple in my diet. I cook it with water and I add a little cinnamon and cloves, and I dice up 1/4 of a granny smith apple in it to sweeten it up. VERY filling. Cottage cheese...I gag at the sight of the stuff, lol. And gum works very well for me when it's a mental hunger, or boredom.

Celery and Green Bell Peppers are basically the only veggies I can stand to eat. I can eat a little bit of carrots before I get sick of them, and I can stand a little cauliflower too, but not what the program calls for. Is V8 or V8 Fusion a good alternative?
 
V8. V8 Fusion as too many added sugars. I do the V8 at 70 calories and it tastes fine..add some hot sauce or pepper to perk it up if you want :)
 
Never thought about "seasoning" my V8, lol! I read the label on the V8 Fusion, and there is no sugar added, it's all juice blends and water. I got a bottle of the light, and it's only 50 calories per serving. It also says that each serving is 25% of vegetables and 25% of fruits.
 
Think though that the V8 Juice is highish in sugar as its veg juice but without the fiber. As your body (or stomach) does not have the fiber to work through, its the fibers added to the fruits and vegetables which make them a low GI type of food. As your body is working through the fibers, the sugars are that bit more dliuted before they enter your blood stream. Without these fibers, your getting a higher sugar amount in your blood stream. Yes its far lower then that of a normal cola, but its still more beneficial to add some fiber to it- maybe you could eat something with it? or eat that something and just have water instead?

I think your doing amazinly to just up-and change everything at the same time and keep it going, hope its going well.
 
A good part of the reason you are hungry is also because you're eating around 1500 calories a day. At a bit under 400 pounds that is very little. I'd probably be going for twice that amount, both for health reasons and because it will be more sustainable.
 
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make sure you're not starving yourself.

I notice my hunger levels were curbed quite a bit when I stopped eating sugars and imitation sugars.

Meaning: No sweets, not even diet sodas.

By cutting those out, there are some days I struggle to eat 1800 calories, just because I'm not that hungry.

Proteins and whole grain products leave you feeling more full. Also, note:

I'm 185 pounds, 1800-2000 calories is what I eat daily for losing weight, and it's working. Just some food for thought. :)
 
Okay, reading this whole thing made me have to make an account and say something. As far as the Negative Calorie foods; they DO exist. They're basically a food which take more calories to digest than they give by consuming them. And they're amazing for fat loss. And that's another thing. Why do you want to lose WEIGHT? Weight doesn't matter. BODY FAT PERCENTAGE matters. So, who cares about the volume of a food? The only reason that matters to me is that it effects how full you become. (Oh, and I wrestle. But that's a different story.) Basically, if you take your basal metabolic rate (The calories you're body burns without you doing anything), add the number of calories you burn through activity and add the calories burned through digestion, you'll get your calorie allowance for the day. That will tell you how many calories you can eat without losing fat. In a perfect world, I would base my diet off of that amount. But, really, things just get to complicated to calculate all of that. So, I use another method. Since I am trying to lose body fat, I give myself around a 1500 calorie allowance per day. I usually go a little over. (My basal metabolic rate is around 1700-1800). Before I eat anything, I drink a LOT of water. More than is comfortable; more than I want. If I'm still hungry, then I'll eat. If not, I wait. You don't want to eat when you aren't actually in need of sustainance, that's just wasteful and unhealthy. That's why water is what I consider to be the best thing for FAT loss. It'll make you pick up weight at first, if you're dehydrated or eat too much salt. But, like I said who cares? That's what you should use as your diet's staple. Water. Just a warning, I have to pee, like, every hour. And it's always practically clear.
 
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