Weight-Loss Struggling and ready to give up.

Weight-Loss
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ocd

New member
So I have been struggling with binge eating for three months now following my weight loss and today I am just really feeling at the end of my rope with nowhere left to go.

I have examined and re-examined everything, read books on the subject, started seeing a therapist, went to see an eating disorder specialist(both of which I feel have been a waste of time).

I can't get leveled off into proper eating at this point. my current workout routine is as follows. I do light cardio of 3.5mph 4-6 days a week in the mornings on the treadmill, with an hill program, incline 5-8%, 45 to 50 minutes. I also walk to work and back as well as walk home for lunch, a total of about 58 minutes of regular walking. Desk job so I sit around all day. 3 days a week I also do just over an hour of weight training after work, usually monday wednesday friday.

I have been trying to sustain 2400 calories for this, with the intention of a deficit of 300-800 calories a day, being male, with a height of 6'2. My calculation unless I am horribly wrong for a day that I do all three, treadmill, weights, walk to work is about 3000 calories max burned for the day. I go with 5 meals a day. 600, 300, 600, 300, 600 starting from breakfast to dinner in those amounts. I've been careful to add more healthy fats and protien, I use whey particularly after workouts, get lots of vegetables, take vitamin supplements.

The best I have been able to go now is about 7 days without a massive craving and over eating. I am slowly but steadily gaining weight, my pants are all very tight and bordering on needing to go up a waist size. My 32's and 33's barely fit me now and I am just about into needing 34's again. I feel so unbelievably fat and miserable when I feel how tight they are around my legs.

This whole thing is just demoralizing me because I want to keep maintaining muscle and trimming fat but it feels like my body is rejecting any calorie deficit at all and the only way I don't get binge cravings is by going over maintenance consistently. I feel like I am beat, that I can't maintain a deficit any longer and getting fat again is inevitable.

The advice I am getting doesn't help, people telling me to make peace with being heavier, I just view that as such failure, as though I might as well have never even tried, If I have to accept being slightly fat I might as well be back where I was.

I am hoping there is someone out there that has been in this situation and mastered it that can give me some further advice at this point. I just can't get into any kind of rhythm and can't break these binges for long enough for anything to even stabilize. I know I lost weight the wrong way by going super low on calories and sprinting it off really fast, but there has to be some way to maintain this loss. Everything I read and everyone I talk to seems to offer only doom and gloom as far as gaining everything back and then some being what happens 90% of the time in people that lose weight the way I did.

Maybe I just needed to vent too. I am just so frustrated and beaten by this at this point.
 
I struggle with BED as well. It is tough to lose weight when your emotions are so connected to food. I understand your struggle. :(

Here are some tips I have found really help me. It takes a lot of patience, but you CAN change your habits:


-Don't completely eliminate any foods from your diet (even things like chips and chocolate). If you feel deprived of foods you enjoy, you are far more likely to binge. Instead, try your very hardest to just have a few spoonfuls of ice cream instead of the whole tub for example. It's all about moderation - this isn't all or nothing.

-Practice eating slowly. Try to genuinely enjoy what you are eating rather than gulping down huge amounts without a thought. Savour the flavours and chew every bite carefully.

-Only eat when the food has your undivided attention. Do not eat while watching TV, going on the computer, etc. Try to sit down for every meal and focus on what you are consuming.

-Sip water between bites during a meal, as well as throughout the day. It helps fill you up and curbs the need to binge.

-Practice mantras and recite them in your head or even out loud when you feel like you are weakening and about to binge. Things like, "I am in control of my actions" or "One day at a time" help keep you on track.

-Constantly remind yourself exactly what food is - simply fuel for the body to run properly. It should in no way be connected to emotions. Also, do you really want to make your poor body suffer by feeding it junk when it does so much for you? :D

-Keep yourself full throughout the day. Make sure to eat something nutritious every 2-3 hours to keep your blood sugar stabilized- this really helps prevent cravings.

-If you do binge, don't beat yourself up about it. Move on from the experience and know that you will try harder next time. If you get too upset with yourself, it could lead to more emotional eating and continue the cycle.


I hope some of this will be useful to you as you battle binge eating!
 
It sounds like it's just too much stress on your system right now. However, that doesn't mean you have to gain the weight back.

First, are you steadily going up, or is it just that things are tight after your binges? Sometimes if you binge on high salt, high carb foods you'll gain water weight but it's not as hard to get rid of as actual fat.

Either way, you may need to either cut back on your workouts or increase your food intake for a few weeks until your body adjusts to the new levels. Cut the cardio and do the strength training twice a week until your system has time to recover.

There's a theory that your body has certain weights that it's 'comfortable' with and will try to get back to them. Staying for a while at a new weight (i.e. eat at maintenance or close to it for a while) will help readjust this set point and allow you to continue.

I wish it worked differently. However, there is definitely hope. Right now your body is just overloaded and is trying to deal with that by demanding more calories. If you give it a break when it recovers you'll be able to continue. Now, this may happen again when you're at an even lower weight, but it's not something you can't deal with. You just have to take a deep breath and curse the fact that sometimes less really is more.
 
I wonder if changing your workout might help. If you add more muscle, you'd be able to eat more without worrying as much. How heavy are you lifting? If you're already lifting heavy, maybe your cravings are your body's way of telling you to eat more so that it can build the muscle. If you're not lifting heavy, another approach would be to do heavy cardio, like high intensity interval training. (I wouldn't recommend doing it while lifting heavy though.) Again, maybe by focusing on burning more, you'll be able to eat more. It's been my approach for a little while now; I tend to overeat so instead of eating less, I'll just try to burn more. I've yet to see if it works, but it seems like a good idea in theory.

Also, I haven't had an eating disorder, so I won't claim to know what you're going through. But the book In Defense of Food by Michael Pollan changed the way I eat, and really changed my whole approach to food. I can't promise it will help with binges or cravings, but who knows.
 
I have been practicing a lot of the techniques mentioned above and have been improving my non extreme craving behavior greatly.

I have learned to slow down, insert pauses into eating, I have upped my calories overall but maybe I am just still lying to myself that it is enough out of fear of getting fat.

I haven't had a true eat past the point of physical pain binge in over 10 days, so I suppose that is better than nothing. I still overate badly last Wednesday, and this Wednesday. About 2000 calories over each time, or what I would call a partial binge (meaning a binge but at least not a binge where i went over days in a row and more like 7000 extra calories a day) So I guess that is a positive even if it is small consolation to have improved but not eliminated the problem.

I am truly gaining weight, a very little bit of muscle and mostly fat in my thighs and waist, as that is where my body loves to store fat most of all. My last "clean" non binge bloat weigh in was 179 pounds.

I guess more than anything right now I am just in that angry confused post binge guilt and wanting to vent and feel bad for myself. I have a big problem with all or nothing thinking and irrational thinking coming over me when I get in the guilt phase. It lessens over time but I am just so sick of and worn out by this cycle. I have the hardest time of all with getting into this state where I feel like it's finished, like I can't maintain a deficit any more and I am doomed to have to accept being something other than what I want and will never achieve what I am going for.
 
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It's kind of interesting that you mention that - I was just having a conversation on another forum about guilt being a negative sign in terms of how long you can keep something up. Not that you might never feel guilty about eating, but that it can actually turn into a downward spiral.

The problem with post binge guilt is that it actually makes it easier for you to slide further. "What's the point of trying so hard when I'm just going to screw it up anyway! I may as well accept that I'll just never weight what I want and eat what I want." Believe me, I've been there. I made myself two pans of brownies in two weeks... Telling myself that if I couldn't be skinny I could at least enjoy what I ate. ... I brought the second batch into work because I realized I was being a bit ridiculous.

I still have my higher calorie days. I've even gained back some weight (I've been at this 7 years now) but getting rid of some of the guilt has actually helped. The main thing I do is that I plan for it.

Say you eat an extra 2000 calories. Okay, that means you have to be at a deficit of 100 calories for 20 days. Or 200 calories for 10. Or... at 400 calorie deficit a day that's less than a week to recover from it. Sure, you don't want to do that every week, but in the grand scheme of things it's more of a blip. ... A frustrating blip that can let you beat yourself up - but the truth is, beating yourself up is less productive than looking ahead and saying "Ok, I gave myself a break but now I'm back on track."

I do think it's also possible that if you're getting these huge cravings you may need to de-stress. I don't have the article on hand but there was something recent by Lyle McDonald about undereating and over-working and how they suspect that keeping your cortisol levels too high can actually work against you.

It may be easier to be obsessive about things in the short term, but you may actually need a break. You can do a couple things - give yourself a week and just eat until you feel like you've had enough. If you gain more than 5 lbs, then worry about counting calories. Take a break from working out during this week as well. Then start fresh and motivated - don't look at this week as a 'cheat' look at it is giving your system a break and lowering cortisol levels. That does not mean go to all the buffets you can think of and eat like crazy, it just means try not to stress.

Or you can cut back on your workouts and up calories another 100-200 a day. If you're not gaining then you should still be ok.

I know I rambled a bit, but hopefully some of this helps! Also, know that if you work at focusing on your next steps rather than the guilt, over time it gets easier to cope with the guilt! (Or at least it has for me!)

Hang in there.
 
OCD, I think you need to widen your perspectives a little. Your internal world is getting a little too small and your weight loss is becoming too big an issue.

Life is a journey and we achieve everything we achieve by taking one small step after another and not every step is a step forward.

And even when we do take a backward step there is always time and opportunity to take a forward step later.

Don't be so hard on yourself. Remember you are human and treat yourself kindly.
 
dude, i'm 6'2" as well. Honestly here's what you need to do.

You're underweight. Seriously. Stop worrying about what your pant size is. Instead here's what you should do. Keep eating the same, hell, eat more. Then you can binge till you're stuffed daily. And start hitting the weights. Like hard, super hard. Lift till you're ground up into the ground. And I don't mean useless machines or bi curls. I mean toss 200lbs onto the bar and squat till your legs drop off.

In a couple months, you'll be gaining weight, yes. But you'll look sooooo much better..

Take if from me, I was 195lbs in June. 6'2". I weight just over 240lbs now. I've gained 45lbs and I look soooo much better and healthier. Waist went from 35-39. But my chest went from 43-48 and arms from 14.5 to 16. Everyone I havn't seen for a while comments on how much better and stronger I look. Loving it so far. And when you lift that heavy and gain that sort of mass, losing it is a snap. I'm eating 5-6k calories a day to build this. When I lose, I'm dropping down to 3k a day and figure I'll have no problems.

When you lift heavy, your metabolism spikes into the stratosphere. Makes losing a snap. Makes gaining a complete pain in the ass because you have to literally stuff your face till you're ready to puke all day every day.
 
Well, I apologize for giving in to negativity and despair when I posted that rant. I did it again, I lied to myself about what I was doing.

I thank people for the responses.

To Jynus, I don't think that's viable for me, I am too weak right now to lift anything resembling that kind of weight. My muscle mass is so depleted I can barely handle 100 pounds on squats much less 200.

When I sat and thought about it my base needs for the day sedentary are an estimate of 2200-2300 calories. I went two days with 50 minutes of treadmill 50 minutes of regular walking, and just over an hour of bulk sets of 4 at the gym. If I use a rough estimate of 300 calories burned per hour of physical activity, and in reality it was probably a little more for the treadmill and weights because they were both strenuous, that puts me at a rough estimate of 3100 to 3200 calories expended and 2400 taken in, along with probably not enough protein and foolishly lifting exhaustion sets in a deficit with a metabolism that is already in starvation response. It probably isn't any wonder why that would trigger the binge craving response.

I suppose I am at the phase where my screwed up metabolism isn't going to accept a deficit until I reset it with several weeks or months of maintenance with proper foods. At least that's what I intend to try to stick to this time and not talk myself into sneaking into great big deficit again when I start feeling a bit better. I just have such a serious self image issue. I don't see the same thing in the mirror that other people see. All I see is fat, and I feel like the fattest pig in the world with a 32 inch waist right now, it keeps making me creep back into lying to myself and trying to starve off what's left of my body fat.
 
You just have your head in a cycle of negative thinking which you have pinned to your body image. Underpinning that is possibly low self esteem, stress from somewhere or anxiety.

You can break the thinking patterns but it takes discipline - which you have because you have proven you can discipline yourself.

- the gentlest way to rebuild some muscle is through yoga, it's also very calming
- 3 healthy meals a day will give your body some much needed fuel
- Cognitive Behavioural Training (CBT) is good for breaking thinking patterns (everytime you have a negative self image thought you can dismiss it)

Unfortunately negative thinking can become entrenched (as can any type of thinking pattern which becomes a belief) and it can be very difficult to break it. Once people have entrenched thinking they can be extremely resistant to changing that thinking pattern.

Psychologists spend a lot of time trying to break through the barriers of entrenched thinking because most people don't want to give up a thought process that has become comfortable even though if it is unpleasant for them.

However I often find intelligent people can be reached eventually. Logic is logic, facts are facts and intelligent people can hear the truth of it.

You are incredibly articulate which means your issues are visible to you which means you can analyse and think your way out of where you are. But it is a process and it takes time.

Take care of yourself OCD.
 
Spinner1964 said:
You just have your head in a cycle of negative thinking which you have pinned to your body image. Underpinning that is possibly low self esteem, stress from somewhere or anxiety.

You can break the thinking patterns but it takes discipline - which you have because you have proven you can discipline yourself.

- the gentlest way to rebuild some muscle is through yoga, it's also very calming
- 3 healthy meals a day will give your body some much needed fuel
- Cognitive Behavioural Training (CBT) is good for breaking thinking patterns (everytime you have a negative self image thought you can dismiss it)

Unfortunately negative thinking can become entrenched (as can any type of thinking pattern which becomes a belief) and it can be very difficult to break it. Once people have entrenched thinking they can be extremely resistant to changing that thinking pattern.

Psychologists spend a lot of time trying to break through the barriers of entrenched thinking because most people don't want to give up a thought process that has become comfortable even though if it is unpleasant for them.

However I often find intelligent people can be reached eventually. Logic is logic, facts are facts and intelligent people can hear the truth of it.

You are incredibly articulate which means your issues are visible to you which means you can analyse and think your way out of where you are. But it is a process and it takes time.

Take care of yourself OCD.
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I often refer to myself as having been too smart for my own good in life. I was gifted enough to get by in school without even trying and with that I developed a very bad attitude and ego early on in life. In actuality I underachieved greatly because of that ego and it set me on the path to many of the same negative behaviours that kept me fat for all those years. I developed an attitude stemming back to childhood that I didn't have to work hard to get by. It wasn't until the weight loss journey that I even made real progress into breaking that mentality.

I am obsessive compulsive to a large and destructive degree as well. As much as I am capable of logic though, I can be so stupid at the same time in self destructive patterns. Such as I mentioned with my education and with my obsessive nature leading me to lie to myself and follow my own self devised notions that are often based on fact but greatly distorted by my own underlying goals.

I am seeing a therapist mind you and she has indicated that there are medications that directly target obsessive compulsives. I am loathe to turn to pills to be honest, but I am giving it consideration. I thought I could channel my obsessive behaviour to help me with weight loss and I did at that, but in doing so I did it in such a way that while it got results it did damage to my metabolism and put me into this which I admit I did not see coming at all.

I suppose what they say is true, in a battle with the mind and your bodies hormones the body and the hormones are going to kick your ass soundly every time no matter how hard you steel up your willpower and tell yourself you can ride it through something like a starvation trigger.

Thank you for your advice and support.
 
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Are you really suffering from OCD? You seem to be quite analytical and focussed and perhaps you need to use your disciplined nature to re-focus and deal with life in a less destructive way.

That's not OCD. That's more a temperament. Some people are analytical, focussed, energetic and disciplined. The upside is they can be very competent and capable people the world comes to rely on. The downside is they can apply their natural talents in destructive ways.

This is a matter of recognising that anyone person's strengths can be turned inwards and become weaknesses.

I am an analyst, I work primarily with analysts and I have been managing analysts for decades. I know the temperament very well and I actually enjoy exploring other analysts thinking. Fun crowd!

You are the boss of you. You get to decide how you will deal with life, what you will think about, what you give priority and ultimately how you will feel. Drugs don't do that for you - they may settle you down but they don't change how you really think or feel.

You need to 'let go' in your head. Problem with analysts is they like to be in control of themselves (and their world) and they're poor at letting things go. Then they spiral about not in control (not that they ever really were) and it freaks them out - they get wired, tired, anxious and stressed to max.

If I were you I would come up with a new routine and plan, refocus my mind onto a constructive path and implement it with discipline. Forget about your weight. It's not the real issue for you. This is about learning how to work with how your head really works in a constructive way that makes your life better and not worse.

BTW, your posts are always a good read! :)
 
Spinner1964 said:
Are you really suffering from OCD? You seem to be quite analytical and focussed and perhaps you need to use your disciplined nature to re-focus and deal with life in a less destructive way.

That's not OCD. That's more a temperament. Some people are analytical, focussed, energetic and disciplined. The upside is they can be very competent and capable people the world comes to rely on. The downside is they can apply their natural talents in destructive ways.

This is a matter of recognising that anyone person's strengths can be turned inwards and become weaknesses.

I am an analyst, I work primarily with analysts and I have been managing analysts for decades. I know the temperament very well and I actually enjoy exploring other analysts thinking. Fun crowd!

You are the boss of you. You get to decide how you will deal with life, what you will think about, what you give priority and ultimately how you will feel. Drugs don't do that for you - they may settle you down but they don't change how you really think or feel.

You need to 'let go' in your head. Problem with analysts is they like to be in control of themselves (and their world) and they're poor at letting things go. Then they spiral about not in control (not that they ever really were) and it freaks them out - they get wired, tired, anxious and stressed to max.

If I were you I would come up with a new routine and plan, refocus my mind onto a constructive path and implement it with discipline. Forget about your weight. It's not the real issue for you. This is about learning how to work with how your head really works in a constructive way that makes your life better and not worse.

BTW, your posts are always a good read! :)
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The therapist I am seeing told me she felt I was obsessive compulsive the first session I spent with her. I have been hesitant to take her advice because of that. It seemed far to fast to be slapping a diagnosis on someone you just met, particularly someone who is admittedly obsessed with a specific topic like weight loss based completely on a lifetime of ridicule and low self esteem stemming from it. This and the elation of losing the weight then having ones body "turn" on them and having what worked before not work any longer.

I definitely see the mood swings and this is where the medical profession is fast to reach for the drugs. The main reason I am considering I guess is it does seem that it could be beneficial to have every tool to help level my moods out to get past this problem. Still I am unsure. Drugs hold an even bigger stigma to me than before, because along the way as I was losing weight I was so positive and just brimming with self confidence coming to me for the first time in a very long time. That was the best part of all. It wasn't till this scenario of the starvation cravings started that it threw my moods all about. When I discovered this change to myself, especially the elimination of my social anxiety I became convinced that drugs were never a necessity in my life(I had been on antidepressants once several years earlier).

That seems to be a big factor for me as well as far as fear goes. The feeling of having control as you say over something like my weight again was pure elation. To have such a simple formula of eat less exercise more work so fast gave me a feeling of control I had never known. This binge response took that away so drastically. To feel so out of control, it is a source of extreme anxiety to say the least. I am pretty sure my hair has greyed significantly in the last three months, (I actually colored it for the first time this week because of this). I have been called a control freak by people in my life though I have never really considered myself one.

Fear of going back to that out of control, lazy maker of excuses is a killer for me, and it sets in every time I start to eat maintenance calories again. If I don't exercise I have a way of telling myself I am failing and slipping back to being that guy. Dichotomous thinking is a very big factor in my life, this is something I have come to understand as I read a book on binge eating recently with a specific chapter devoted to dichotomous thinking.

I'm working on it all in the end, the tough part for me is riding out the bursts of fear and emotion right now that are setting me back.
 
I always look for the most obvious cause of anything and eliminate that possible cause first.

- It is possible your mood swings are because you are just very very tired. Given your history of rapid weight loss it would make sense your body is tired and needs time to rest and recuperate.

- It is possible your 'binges' are related to your body being tired. When we get tired we want to eat more to keep our energy levels up. If we try and deny the hunger it can just make us hungrier.

- Eat lots of good healthy food (forget about the calories and focus on the quality & quantity). Get lots of good quality rest - time to put your feet up and relax doing whatever it is that relaxes you.

- After doing that for a month (or more) and you still feel moody then you can look into why you are feeling moody.

- And if you feel better then you can rebuild a diet and exercise programme that is sustainable long term.

And yes, I too would question any therapist that diagnosed me on sight. That is a healthy scepticism. A good therapist will take their time before handing out such a serious assessment. It is very dangerous to label people casually.

Drug can have their place but it's not the first place I would go either. That said, if I thought I needed them I would take them (but I'd take some convincing!).

Your elation at being able to lose weight is normal. Something you felt was out of your control that made you feel bad about yourself came under your management - of course you were thrilled - who wouldn't be? But it all went a bit too far and now you need to refocus yourself and rebuild your physical and emotional strength again.

It's all part of learning what works for us and what doesn't. We all make mistakes and then we learn. It's nothing to get over wrought about. It's just how many people learn - they try something, it doesn't quite work how they expected, so they learn from the experience, find another way and move on. That's how we learn to walk!

And you are alarming yourself. That's the 'bursts of fear'. You think about something that scares you (getting fat, being out of control, being lazy), your body releases adrenalin and you interpret that as fear or anxiety or a mood swing. Stop scaring yourself like that. Go to the bottom line - what if all of those things happen or are true - can you live with that? If the answer is yes then there is nothing to be scared about. CBT that into your brain and you won't scare yourself.

None of this makes you lazy or crazy in any way. You're seem quite normal but looking for complex reasoning for your behaviour. There probably aren't any complex reasons - you're just learning about you and the best way you can manage you and your life.

As for grey hair - ha ha! We all go grey (unless we go bald). I'm going grey (cunningly disguised as a blonde these days) but it's a by product of aging - nothing more. Most of us end up dying our hair - it's kind of fun - I used to be a brunette!
 
One thing that might help is to set a different goal while you're letting your system recover. It helps with the control issue - for example, set a goal on becoming more flexible and start doing stretches. Then when you start feeling like you're out of control because you don't weigh exactly what you want, tell yourself "No, I'm choosing to focus on recovery and flexibility. This is my decision, and I like it."

... I may be a bit of an analytic sort myself :p And little mental tricks like this seem to help with the feeling of control. In a way I think it's a form of rationalization, but surely humans have all these little rationalization and justification tricks for use in a positive sense and not just the negative!
 
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Ha ha! Jeanette you certainly are an analyst. I enjoy reading your posts too. I learn a lot from your very clear but concise explanations.

And yes, I agree those 'mental tricks' are a good way to focus the brain and motivate. I like to use 'visualisation' which I find very powerful to help the brain get ready for any challenging experience. These days I actually dream about training! Go figure. Visualisation plus CBT at it's most positive best!
 
Thanks! :) I'm only a teeeeny bit of an analyst... I have been trying to work on visualization myself, but I have a tendency to forget about it. I've had some good experiences with it - although I rarely dream about training. At least not that I remember :D But it sounds a lot more positive than say... dreaming about calculus :D
 
It's been a while since I dreamed about calculus, but it has happened! I need to figure out how to dream about training instead! :D
 
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