Help for a lost soul

S

Splashy

0
This topic is touching more or less every forum in here, so I'm hoping this is the best place to post it.

All of a sudden I have a new motivation to start working out, so I need to make use of it while it's still there and see if I can get myself into a position where I think of working out as something positive, hehe.
However, from several failed attempts at starting a training routine earlier, I thought I should get some starting help this time before I dived into it.

Some personal facts:
- Boy
- 24 years
- 130 pounds (61kg)
- 6 feet (184cm)

My primary goal is to gain weight and increase the muscle mass of my entire body, my secondary goal is to increase my stamina and get into shape (in regards to not falling over dead after jogging 100 yards).

I eat about 3 times a day, but I do not eat a lot every time. I get filled up very fast, and then hungry again very quickly as well, however at that point I'm usually in a place where I can't take the time to eat (like at work).

My previous attempts have involved getting right into it. Working out 4 times a week, taking protein shakes, carb supplements etc.
My problem was that, I'm not sure if I was doing too much too fast, but training just had the opposite effect on me. I lost energy, and had less energy overall, and I just got less happy over time, so I quit.

What I'm wondering really is how I should proceed when starting out this time around, to keep my motivation up, and to make working out something positive.

Is there any supplements I should be taking, being in the rather poor situation I'm in? Thinking about protein shakes, weight gainers, carbs?

Thanks in advance for any answers! :)
 
Welcome! There are a few Florida folks on this forum; where in Florida are you?

My thoughts / recommendations:

1. Supplements are no panacea and nothing than a smart diet can't provide (other than the postworkout shake).

2. To effect your first goal, increasing muscle mass, you need to start weight training, pronto. I am following The New Rules of Lifting and am pleased with it. As a bonus, it is a surprisingly fun book to read, which is not what I would have expected from a weight training book. If you follow another program - great, but make sure you do compound exercises with reasonably heavy weights and moderate repetitions, typically 6 - 8. Squats, deadlifts, bench press, pullups, dips, rows, are all good. If you don't know how to do these - learn from this forum, the internet, the trainers, other gym rats, books, etc. Deadlifts, especially, can cause problems if not done correctly. But, don't be lured into using the circuit machines. Well, maybe at first, but only as an intermediate step into the land of the free weights at the gym. Take a postworkout protein shake within 30 minutes of your workout.

3. For stamina, you need to exercise differently. You need to convince your cardiovascular and musculoskeletal systems that you need more capillarization and mitochondria in your muscles and you need to be able to go longer before your muscles go anaerobic and withstand the inevitable lactic acid when it inevitably does go anaerobic. To accomplish this, you need to do workouts that are at least 30 minutes continuously in duration (longer is almost always better and that is true here). Go cycling, running, swimming, play basketball or rugby for 30 - 60 minutes 4x / week and you will develop stamina. You may have to build up to these times, so don't expect to go more than 30 minutes 3x/week at first. If you do gym stuff (e.g., elliptical, treadmill, etc.), the boredom is horrendous unless you have the focus of a Marine sniper, so I would not recommend that way unless you have no other options.

Good luck!
 
g8r80 said:
Welcome! There are a few Florida folks on this forum; where in Florida are you?

My thoughts / recommendations:

1. Supplements are no panacea and nothing than a smart diet can't provide (other than the postworkout shake).

2. To effect your first goal, increasing muscle mass, you need to start weight training, pronto. I am following The New Rules of Lifting and am pleased with it. As a bonus, it is a surprisingly fun book to read, which is not what I would have expected from a weight training book. If you follow another program - great, but make sure you do compound exercises with reasonably heavy weights and moderate repetitions, typically 6 - 8. Squats, deadlifts, bench press, pullups, dips, rows, are all good. If you don't know how to do these - learn from this forum, the internet, the trainers, other gym rats, books, etc. Deadlifts, especially, can cause problems if not done correctly. But, don't be lured into using the circuit machines. Well, maybe at first, but only as an intermediate step into the land of the free weights at the gym. Take a postworkout protein shake within 30 minutes of your workout.

3. For stamina, you need to exercise differently. You need to convince your cardiovascular and musculoskeletal systems that you need more capillarization and mitochondria in your muscles and you need to be able to go longer before your muscles go anaerobic and withstand the inevitable lactic acid when it inevitably does go anaerobic. To accomplish this, you need to do workouts that are at least 30 minutes continuously in duration (longer is almost always better and that is true here). Go cycling, running, swimming, play basketball or rugby for 30 - 60 minutes 4x / week and you will develop stamina. You may have to build up to these times, so don't expect to go more than 30 minutes 3x/week at first. If you do gym stuff (e.g., elliptical, treadmill, etc.), the boredom is horrendous unless you have the focus of a Marine sniper, so I would not recommend that way unless you have no other options.

Good luck!
Click to expand...

Some great points - I always think as with overweight people; hardgainers tend to look for a magic supplement or product to put on weight. Simple fact is you need to eat; and eat a lot of quality nutritionaly dense foods. I know how tough it can be to fit in meals at work - but how about a glass of whole milk between meals so that your muscles are not always in a catabolic state?

Also agree with weight training - that is a definite must if you want to add some size. Just stay consistant with whatever plan you decide to follow. All the best
 
Make sure that what you have is good though. Some good complex carbs, wholegrain stuff and other stuff with lots of fibre in to keep your body supplied with fuel for longer. As well as the milk suggestion which is good, you could also stick a bag of nuts, obviously non salted are better for your heart but anyways they take a while to break down and you can just have a handful now and then.

I would also suggest as your starting out don't go too heavy as it can put you off. Perhaps try 3 sets of 10 or 20 as your trying to build up stamina - this works well in conjunction with cardio. It will also give you some bulk. Keep breaks between sets to about 90 secs to 2 mins. This will improve your anaerobic limit allowing you to work harder for longer.

From personal experience this works great. As well as weights (mainly compound exercises as mentioned already) and cardio don't underestimate push ups, dips, pull ups, squat thrusts.

All the best
 
Hardgainer is another term for someone who does not eat enough. That is why you lost energy in your previous attempts at bulking up, you simply did not have enough fuel in your system.

Since you get full quickly, you're going to need to expand your stomach. Eat till you're full, then eat some more.

You're going to need to learn about a proper diet for bulking. For starters, take a look at the stickies in the nutrition forum.

In regards to a weight training routine, do you have any preferences? Again, start out by reading the stickies in this forum, mainly the 'weight training 101' and 'thinking of posting your inefficient split' stickies.
 
Thanks for all the replies!
I'm planning on starting a new routine this Monday, that basically involves working out on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays, eating 5-6 times a day (good rich foods).
Trying to shoot in a meal replacement at work between breakfast and lunch etc to get some more carbs/proteins in, and the usual protein shake to supplement post-workout training, see how that all works out.
Maybe after a few weeks of relatively light training, I'll move onto some type of gainer etc.

Thanks for all the help! =) And I do agree with the fact that hardgainers look for as many shortcuts as people trying to diet.
My main problem will indeed be to cook/make all the meals etc. (Not that I'm a bad cook, I just hate doing it, (read: I hate doing the dishes :p) haha).
 
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matk said:
hardgainers tend to look for a magic supplement or product to put on weight. Simple fact is you need to eat; and eat a lot of quality nutritionaly dense foods.
Click to expand...
This ^^

evan said:
Hardgainer is another term for someone who does not eat enough. That is why you lost energy in your previous attempts at bulking up, you simply did not have enough fuel in your system.

Since you get full quickly, you're going to need to expand your stomach. Eat till you're full, then eat some more.

You're going to need to learn about a proper diet for bulking. For starters, take a look at the stickies in the nutrition forum.

In regards to a weight training routine, do you have any preferences? Again, start out by reading the stickies in this forum, mainly the 'weight training 101' and 'thinking of posting your inefficient split' stickies.
Click to expand...

And lots of this ^^

Eat lots. Lift heavy. Run. Repeat :)
 
Splashy said:
Thanks for all the replies!
I'm planning on starting a new routine this Monday, that basically involves working out on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays, eating 5-6 times a day (good rich foods).
Trying to shoot in a meal replacement at work between breakfast and lunch etc to get some more carbs/proteins in, and the usual protein shake to supplement post-workout training, see how that all works out.
Maybe after a few weeks of relatively light training, I'll move onto some type of gainer etc.

Thanks for all the help! =) And I do agree with the fact that hardgainers look for as many shortcuts as people trying to diet.
My main problem will indeed be to cook/make all the meals etc. (Not that I'm a bad cook, I just hate doing it, (read: I hate doing the dishes :p) haha).
Click to expand...

1.) You seem to have the right idea about supplements. Use a meal replacement where you normally would not get to eat a meal, some people think it's a good idea to actually replace a meal with it. Protein shakes are great for post-workout, also pre-workout.

2.) What type of routine will you be doing? I'd suggest a full-body routine that consists of big, heavy, compound, freeweight lifts.

3.) What are you planning on eating? I'm sure you don't want to put on much fat, just good, lean muscle.

4.) You don't have a dishwasher do you?
 
evan said:
1.) You seem to have the right idea about supplements. Use a meal replacement where you normally would not get to eat a meal, some people think it's a good idea to actually replace a meal with it. Protein shakes are great for post-workout, also pre-workout.

2.) What type of routine will you be doing? I'd suggest a full-body routine that consists of big, heavy, compound, freeweight lifts.

3.) What are you planning on eating? I'm sure you don't want to put on much fat, just good, lean muscle.

4.) You don't have a dishwasher do you?
Click to expand...

I'll answer in sequence :)

I'll be doing a routine that consists of very compound exercises like you said. Mostly: Squats, deadlifts, incline press, pulldowns, arnold press, biceps curl, triceps press, rowing.

The routine basically is doing all those excercises 3 times a week, not a lot of isolation, but just working your whole body 3 times a week (Monday Wednesday Friday).
Also need to find a good way to train my abs though.

Then I'll put in some stamina building stuff somewhere, either jogging or interval running of some sorts, not sure if I should do it as part of the weight lifting (like right after), or do it on the "off days".

For eating It will go a lot in whole grain bread, featuring cheese, turkey and a nice Norwegian thing called "leverpostei" (basically made from liver of pigs/cattle whatever). Then rice, chicken, ground beef, scrambled eggs, pasta, fruit, yogurt. Then for "snacks" cashews, pistachios (salted, might not be the best for my heart, but easier to eat at least).
On top of that I will go with a meal replacement between breakfast and lunch, and assorted protein shakes either just after workout or maybe also to supplement other meals.

I do actually have a dishwasher, I just don't wash pots and pans there :p

edit: I also ordered the creatine serum type (like the drop you put under your tongue). My routine thingy tells me to take it after workout, the label tells me before, haha
 
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You can actually take the creatine whenever. Creatine works by having a steady intake of it. So you can take it any time of day, as long as you take it everyday, and it is probably a good idea to take it the same time of day everyday.

Your routine sounds good. If it gets to be too much to do Squats and Deadlifts everytime you exercise, you can alternate them (i.e. Squats on Monday, Deadlifts on Wednesday... with the rest of your routine the same as you listed).

For abs, try planks and side-planks, cable and dumbbell woodchops, and you can always do crunches and leg lifts.

Your diet looks good to me, just make sure you are getting the right quantity of everything. You'll probably need to eat somewhere around 2500 to 3000 calories a day. Use a BMI calculator to figure out your maintenance level considering activity level, then add about 500 calories.

I will say that cardio activity will work against weight gain. You build muscle with a surplus of nutrients, and cardio uses up some of those nutrients. So, if you find that you're not making gains, cut the cardio out of your routine. You could just eat more, but I think it's easier to stop cardio for the most part, then pick it back up when you've reached a weight you're happy with.
 
Yea. In regards to the creatine I'm taking the serum type, so it should be easy to just take it just before workout or something like that (only on the days I work out though).

My routine is part of a bigger program, and it's not extremely intensive, we're talking 15 reps 1-2 sets of each exercise.

Thanks for the ab exercises.

In regards to calories, according to a formula with my current lifestyle I need 1900 calories a day, with the "new" lifestyle of working out 3-5 days a week (including cardio) I need about 2500 a day. So 3000 should give me some excess.

I'll see how the first weeks pan out in regards to cardio + weights, and take it from there.
Thanks for all the tips ;)
 
If you can, post your entire routine, or a link to it. To build muscle, lifting heavy weights is key. You routine sounds like an endurance building routine for runners, cyclists, or something like that. 1 or 2 sets of 15 reps will build muscular endurance, but isn't the best for hypertrophy (building muscle).

You're probably better off doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps or 5 sets of 5 reps. The lower the rep count, the heavier the weight you can lift. You do more sets to make up for the lower number of reps on each set.

In order for creatine to work, you need to maintain it in your system. That requires that you take it everyday. It won't do much of anything if you only take it on days that you workout.
 
The entire thing is in Norwegian.

To summarize, it's basically a 7 week routine that repeats itself over and over:


First you figure out how much weight you can do 10 reps of for each of the exercises.
Then:
Week 1 : 15 reps with 0.6-0.75 of your 10rep weight
Week 2-3: 10 reps with 0.8 - 1.05 of your 10rep weight
Week 4-6: 5 reps with 1-1.4 of your 10 rep weight + dropsets on some of the exercises.
Week 7: rest

The theory behind this, is to reset your muscles every 7 weeks so the binding tissue degrades back to a level where lower weights will help break down the muscle tissue again.

Like, in the beginning you will have very little of the binding tissue, so small weights will be effective, but as the body gets used to them they will be less effective, so you increase, and increase every week, until at the end of week 6 you stop, rest for 9 days, and reset back to a level where u can lift more light again.

In regards to creatine, I understand where you're coming from in regards to the monohydrate, as you need to load it etc, but the serum type is something different, and both the program and the directions on the bottle says to use it only on days you're working out?
 
I thought the creatine serum was creatine monohydrate, just in a different form that is supposedly better absorbed. However, I could be wrong about that.

I used the creatine serum years ago and I didn't think it worked as well as the powdered monohydrate. However, I can't recall if I took the serum everyday or only on days that I worked out. Also, you don't need to load.

I've never done a routine like you describe. Let us know how it works for you.
 
I'll come back with the results some day :)

In regards to the creatine serum, I'm gonna send it back and just start with the monohydrate, including loading phases, maintenance and all that stuff..
From what I can deduce the serum stuff is just a hoax
 
I briefly scanned most of the posts in here and from my limited experience I have to agree: lift hard and eat hard.

I too am a hard gainer (however I was never as light as you were) but this summer I managed to gain about 15 lbs. I've been concentrating on only doing full body workouts in 5x6 format. If you lift hard trust me you will be hungry. And when you are hungry seriously just go bananas. I'm not talking eating junk food but eat good food and don't worry about over eating. It sounds so simple but it's hard in practice.
 
It's true that people who cannot gain mass is because of lacking nutrition. The lack of proper nutrition also means you cannot have enough stamina to do bench, squats, deads etc When you start lifting seriously, your body will create a "demand" for nutrition and will use this to repair your muscles and grow.

There is no need for a 6ft 130# male to eat maintenance calories, do 15-20 reps and then say he is a hard-gainer. There is a saying that LIFT BIG, EAT BIG. Keep your reps in the 8-12 rep range and do compunds like squats, deads, bench, military, powercleans etc
 
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