Advice needed Weight Loss plan.....

Fat Joe

New member
Here is some info about me:
I am 5'11" 300-310lbs 31yrs old.
I currently work in a office so I get no exercise, i work Evenings from 4pm-12am, will be working days 8-4 coming in august. I do drink 6-8 beers on a daily basis, no hard liq (Vodka, rum, teq, ec.) which I plan on quiting now. I also drink 2 16-20oz cups of coffee daily.
I am a very picky eater, I do not like vegetables, only eat corn, potatoes, baked beans, and thats about it. Dont like too many fruits, just Oranges & Apples & Jarred Peaches.

I used the GNC Total Lean - Advance last year with this GNC Greens vitamin (GNC rep advice it will make up for the Veggies). It worked effectively for about 3 months till i quit. I use to workout about 1 hour daily, either treadmill @ gym or bike riding. I was losing weight, but I began drinking beer on a daily basis & ended up quiting the diet.

I see that GNC Total lean was discontinued a couple of months ago.

Herbalife seems like a really good plan, but pretty expensive even with ebay.
any other recommendation would be greatly appreciated.

I do plan on exercising the same as last time, 45-60 min daily.

I remember when i wasn't on Total Lean I was tired a lot & would drink coffee (which i drink with half & half or whole milk).

Any other advice about kicking the beer habit will help too.

Thanks,
Joe.
 
Hey Joe. I definitely think kicking the 6-8 beer a day habit will give you some results. Combine that with exercising 4-6 times per week and some clean eating and your on your way.

I don't know how dependent you are on the 6-8 beers a day and I am not an expert but, maybe if it is too hard for you to quit all at once just limiting yourself to one a day, then once that becomes easy, maybe one or two a week? I dunno. I just know that quitting something like that can be really hard for some people. I wish you all the best with that. Also, perhaps limiting yourself to one really good cup of coffee in the morning wouldn't be a bad idea either.

If you haven't exercised in awhile I wouldn't start out too fast. Start out slow and do it consistently. Your body will let you know when you can do more. Everytime I tried to lose weight before this time I was doing too much too soon and I would get tired and burnt out within a couple of weeks. This time I originally started out kind of slow but, gradually increased my workout intensity, and it has been great.

I know you said you hated vegetables, and all the "vegetables" you listed as liking are actually starches. I would say perhaps find a vegetable that you can stand, or barely stand. Vegetables are very important in a diet. I try to get mine from salads mainly, or broccoli with a few sprinkles of parm.cheese is really pretty good.

I wish you the best of luck. You can do this, you just have to be prepared to make a few changes and switch a few bad habits to good habits. A lot of it's mental.

-Sam:)
 
I am a very picky eater, I do not like vegetables,
When I have heard people m ake this statement, it's generally because they haven't liked the preparation methods used in the past - like perhaps growing up in my house and eating canned vegetables or frozen broccoli (both of which I find revolting)

there's a great big beautiful world of green, yellow, orange, red, white, and purple vegetables out there that are delicious -it's just finding the right preparation method and not cooking it til it's dead.

Roasting is agreat way to go with vegetables -especially broccoli - just a little olive oil, maybe some garlic and the vegetable goes on a cookie sheet into a hot oven (I use my toaster oven) til it gets a vibrant green.. .then when it comes out sprinkle on some parmesan cheese... and they're quite tasty.
 
Hi Mate,

We are quite similar in the way we like to eat and what we eat. Also our weight - also to do with when we work.

I can when I get home send you an e-mail with what i actually have done to start shedding my weight and also a similar diet - but dude as already mentioned you need your Veggi's!!!

I used to hate them myself but when I stopped smoking (2years ago) I started to taste things differently so started to love Brocolli, also as mentioned it all depends on how you prepare your food mate.

One thing I disagree with is the point of cutting your beer down to 1 a day - thats not a good idea. You really have got to do it gradually if your depending on it. perhaps reduce it by 2 cans a day for a week or two then another 2 for 2 more weeks etc... then only drink once a week !!!! I have given up drinking 3 weeks ago and staying off it until October. I love drinking in the evenings but it is a weight killer mate!!!.

My Body Fat% was almost 40% and I bet most of that was due to Alcohol. You could also try changing your beer to a light beer content.

Just a few sugesstions matey - hope they help.

Good Luck.
 
I'm not advocating alcohol consumption.

But just as a note 6-8 beers by themselves even every day won’t directly cause overall fat loss or gain.

Alcohol when in your system does completely inhibit the burning of fat because the body switches to basically "panic" mode and diverts all power to getting the alcohol out of your system... as it is a toxin.

That being said weight loss/gain is still a function of overall calories eaten in a day compared to how many you burn off in the same day.

For example, what do you think would happen if you drank 2 beers a day, and ate or drank nothing else but water.

Even if you just sat around and did nothing, I'd wager a good chunk of change that you'd lose weight. And pretty quickly!

Just something to ponder.
 
I'm not advocating alcohol consumption.

But just as a note 6-8 beers by themselves even every day won’t directly cause overall fat loss or gain.

Alcohol when in your system does completely inhibit the burning of fat because the body switches to basically "panic" mode and diverts all power to getting the alcohol out of your system... as it is a toxin.

That being said weight loss/gain is still a function of overall calories eaten in a day compared to how many you burn off in the same day.

For example, what do you think would happen if you drank 2 beers a day, and ate or drank nothing else but water.

Even if you just sat around and did nothing, I'd wager a good chunk of change that you'd lose weight. And pretty quickly!

Just something to ponder.

I'm sorry but this is a horrible example. Everything is not just calories, if you put yourself in the category of being unhealthy then the normal rules of thermodynamic no longer apply to you. Saying something, while seeming harmless, like that on a message board could be a dangerous thing to do. Especially on here.
 
thanks for all the great info everyone.

What does everyone think about herbalife?
Is there another more simple version of herbalife (other product) with less pills & cheaper?
 
I'm not trying to advocate healthy or unhealthy lifestyles or encourage anyone to anything that they don't want to do.

I'm simply trying to get some straight facts out there regarding the truth about weight loss.

It's really not about what you eat, it's about how much you eat, and what macronutrients are in what you eat (protein, carbohydrates, fat.)

And for overall weight loss, if you just care about pounds and not body composition, then macronutrients don't even really come in to play as much as just total calories.

Here's an interesting study on "clean vs unclean" from Lyle McDonald's newsletter

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bray GA et. al. Hormonal Responses to a Fast-Food Meal Compared with Nutritionally Comparable Meals of Different Composition. Ann Nutr Metab. 2007 May 29;51(2):163-171 [Epub ahead of print]


Background: Fast food is consumed in large quantities each day. Whether there are differences in the acute metabolic response to these meals as compared to 'healthy' meals with similar composition is unknown. Design: Three-way crossover. Methods: Six overweight men were given a standard breakfast at 8:00 a.m. on each of 3 occasions, followed by 1 of 3 lunches at noon. The 3 lunches included: (1) a fast-food meal consisting of a burger, French fries and root beer sweetened with high fructose corn syrup; (2) an organic beef meal prepared with organic foods and a root beer containing sucrose, and (3) a turkey meal consisting of a turkey sandwich and granola made with organic foods and an organic orange juice. Glucose, insulin, free fatty acids, ghrelin, leptin, triglycerides, LDL-cholesterol and HDL-cholesterol were measured at 30-min intervals over 6 h. Salivary cortisol was measured after lunch. Results: Total fat, protein and energy content were similar in the 3 meals, but the fatty acid content differed. The fast-food meal had more myristic (C14:0), palmitic (C16:0), stearic (C18:0) and trans fatty acids (C18:1) than the other 2 meals. The pattern of nutrient and hormonal response was similar for a given subject to each of the 3 meals. The only statistically significant acute difference observed was a decrease in the AUC of LDL cholesterol after the organic beef meal relative to that for the other two meals. Other metabolic responses were not different. Conclusion: LDL-cholesterol decreased more with the organic beef meal which had lesser amounts of saturated and trans fatty acids than in the fast-food beef meal.
 
Here's Lyle's comments on the study:

My comments: For a couple of decades, there has been an ongoing argument regarding the issue of 'is a calorie a calorie' in terms of changes on body composition and other parameters. I've addressed this in articles on my website and the newsletter and have made the basic argument that, given identical macronutrient intakes (in terms of protein, carbs, and fats) that there is going to be little difference in terms of bodily response to a given meal.

And that, along with that, the major differences in body weight or composition seen has more to do with the fact that people tend to eat more under certain conditions than others. That is, someone eating a 2000 calorie fast food meal will obviously get a different response than someone eating a 500 or even 1000 calorie clean meal. But at this point, folks end up confounding differences in caloric intake with the quality of the food itself.

In contrast, groups that are obsessed (and I use that word somewhat lightly) with 'eating clean' often make arguments that, somehow, a fast food meal containing an identical amount of protein, carbs and fats as a clean meal containing an identical amount will generate massively different responses (usually in terms of blood glucose and insulin response).

Unfortunately, very little research has examined this in much of a controlled way. Until the paper above came out two weeks ago.

The study's explicit goal was to see if the metabolic response to a fast-food meal would differ to a 'healthy' meal of similar macronutrient and caloric value.

Towards this end six overweight men and two women were recruited to take part in the study although the data in the women was excluded due to the low number and possible gender effects.

Each subject got all three meals on different days with one week in between trials. A standard breakfast was provided at 8am and the test meal was given at exactly 12pm and blood samples were taken every 30 minutes for the first 4 hours and every 60 minutes for the next two hours. Blood glucose, blood lipids, insulin, leptin, ghrelin and free fatty acids were measured.

the test meals consisted of the following (I pasted the list from the PDF but took out the source of each of the ingredients).

Fast food meal: A Big Mac, french fries and root beer sweetened with high fructose corn syrup purchased at the restaurant.

Organic beef meal: this meal used certified organic rangefed ground beef; cheddar cheese; hamburger bun made with unbleached all purpose naturally white flour, non-iodized salt, non-fat powdered milk, natural yeast, canola oil, and granulated sugar; sauce made from canola mayonnaise and organic ketchup; organic lettuce, onion and dill pickles; French fries made from organic potatoes and fried in pure pressed canola oil; and root beer made with cane sugar.

Turkey meal: this consisted of a turkey sandwich made from sliced, roasted free-range turkey breast with no antibiotics or artificial growth stimulants; cheddar cheese; 60% whole wheat bread made with whole wheat and unbleached all-purpose naturally white flours, non-iodized salt, non-fat powdered milk, yeast, vital wheat gluten, canola oil, and granulated sugar; pure pressed canola oil and canola mayonnaise, stone ground mustard; organic lettuce; accompanied by a granola made with Blue Diamond whole natural almonds, Nature's path organic multigrain oatbrain flakes, wholesome sweeteners evaporated cane juice, Spectrum Naturals pure pressed canola oil, clover honey, Sonoma organically grown raisins and dried apples. The beverage was an organic orange juice.

The composition of each meal was as follows
Fast food: 1044 calories, 28.2 grams protein, 53 grams fat, 151 grams carbs
Beef meal: 1154 calories, 28 grams protein, 60.2 grams fat, 163 grams carbs
Turkey meal: 1260 calories, 34 grams protein, 49 grams fat, 170 grams carbs

Note: the meals were similar but not completely identical in composition and I think this is one limitation of the study. It would have been better if they'd made the meals identical in both calorie and macro composition.

The biggest difference between meals had to do with the fatty acid composition: the fast food meal contained twice as much saturated and nearly 8 times as much trans-fatty acids with half of the oleic acid compared to the organic beef meal (which is no surprise). Interestingly, the fast food meal actually contained more linoleic acid than the organic beef meal. The turkey meal had less saturated fat but similar amounts of linoleic and linolenic acid to the fast food meal, with the lowest amount of trans fats.

So what happened. In terms of the blood glucose and insulin response, no difference was seen between any of the meals and this is true whether the data was presented in terms of percentage or absolute change from baseline. The same held true for the ratio of insulin/glucose, no change was seen between any of the meals. Fatty acids showed slight differences, dropping rapidly and then returning to baseline by 5 hours in the beef meals but 6 hours in the turkey meal. Blood triglyceride levels reached a slightly higher peak in the organic beef and turkey meals compared to the fast food meal but this wasn't significant. Changes in leptin were not significant between groups; ghrelin was suppressed equally after all three meals but rose above baseline 5 hours after the fast-food lunch but returned only to baseline in the other two meals.

The only significant difference found in the study was that LDL cholesterol decreased more after both of the organic meals compared to the fast food meal, HDL and total cholesterol showed no change after any of the meals. This was thought to be due to differences in the fatty acid content of the meals (saturated fat typically having a greater negative impact on blood lipid levels than other types of fat).

However, beyond that, there were no differences seen in the response of blood glucose, insulin, blood fatty acids or anything else measured.

Now, the study does have a few limitations:
1. It was only examining a single meal. It's entirely possible that a diet based completely around fast food would show different effects.
2. The sample size was small: 6 overweight men. It's possible that differences would have shown up with more subjects. Also, would lean individuals respond differently? Perhaps but I doubt it. I would have liked to have seen the data on the female subjects as there are often gender differences in response.

I guess my main take home message of this paper is that, at least on a single meal basis, fast food is not going to destroy anybody's diet. This is something I've long believed in based on basic physiology (people tend to lose sight of the fact that all carbs eventually turn into glucose, that the difference in protein tend to be fairly negligible for the most part) but it's nice to see it verified in a real world setting.

It's not uncommon for the physique obsessed to literally become social pariahs, afraid to eat out because eating out is somehow defined as 'unclean' (nevermind that a grilled chicken breast eaten out is fundamentally no different than a grilled chicken breast eaten anywhere else) and fast food is, of course, the death of any diet.

Except that it's not. Given caloric control, the body's response to a given set of nutrients, with the exception of blood lipids would appear to be more determined by the total caloric and macro content of that meal, not the source.

Which is what I've been saying all along.
 
Hey everyone,

I just re-read my first post in this thread.

And I think it kind of does come off as though I am advocating drinking 2 beers a day and nothing else to lose weight.

Just to clear the waters, that is NOT what I am saying, and I do not want to give that impression.

I was merely performing a mental and hypothetical exercise to demonstrate that alcohol in and of itself is not good nor evil and it's not the only thing to look at when trying to get in better shape.

Almost all things in moderation can be managed.

Fat Joe,

Sorry, I've never tried herbalife before and don't know much about the product.

I'm sure someone else on this forum probably has, and I hope they'll help you out.

Be safe out there.
 
fat joe....the only advice I can give at this stage is get off the beers, find some healthy recipes (I like allrecipes.com personally), track your progress on fitday.com, start incorporating some excercise into your day (example: I usually do a 40 minute brisk walk on my hour lunch break), and forget the pills and start thinking of a long term life change, not a short term diet.

best of luck, bro.
 
Hi Joe,

You have specific questions about Herbalife - 10 years ago, I started the Herbalife Weight Loss Program, hoping that I could lose 25-30 lbs. My starting weight was 206. From July 19, 1997 to January 31, 1998, I lost 66 lbs, and have maintained that 140 since, on a maintenance program.

The philosophy behind Herbalife is to come from a nutritional standpoint. There are various programs to choose from, and there is a wholesale program, where you can save 25-42% on purchases, depending on quantity of your order. Throughout my weight loss journey, and in maintenance, I consistently save on grocery expense.

On the beer drinking... once you start to see results on your weight loss, you will be feeling great, and the dependency on the feeling you derive from drinking alcohol, in most cases will subside.

If you have more specific questions, I will do my best to answer for you.

Cathy
 
Last edited:
Hi Joe,

You have specific questions about Herbalife - 10 years ago, I started the Herbalife Weight Loss Program, hoping that I could lose 25-30 lbs. My starting weight was 206. From July 19, 1997 to January 31, 1998, I lost 66 lbs, and have maintained that 140 since, on a maintenance program.

what does the maintenance program consist of?
 
Hey, like lots of others have said, break off some of those beers you might be having.
I just started doing the Weight Watchers program (on my own- no meetings or anything) and I've almost been a month into it and so far have lost 14 or so lbs....It helps make you aware of "portion size" and made me realise just how much I was eating and how many calories or fat it had in it....The diet is easy....so many points in a day based on your weight....for example: when I was 211 I had 26 pts a day....now that I'm at 196 I get 24 pts a day....and they have websites that you can look up points to resturaunts or fast food chains....The diet is also set up so that it's ok if you 'cheat' once or twice a week...
WW also tells you it helps ALOT to drink about 8 cups of water a day...

Hope this helps you out a little
 
what does the maintenance program consist of?
The maintenance program is one meal replacement each day, and two regular meals, plus a couple of daily supplements for good health - not too big on veggies myself! The one meal replacement each day works out for me because I never eat breakfast anyway. You can email me directly if you would like faster response - herbalifecat@gmail.com -

Cathy
 
I have used a product called Isagenix. It's focus is a Cleansing and Fat Burning System that helps you to remove impurities, and can also help you lose weight through nutritional cleansing, meal-replacement shakes, high-quality nutrients and regular exercise.
My wife and I lost a combined 100lbs in 2 months. by following the Cleansing and Fat Burning System. Your Results may vary.
indeed
 
It has been awhile since your first post, Joe. I am wondering if you are still at 6-8 beers a day, or if progress has been made in this situation.

I am not wanting to be mean, harsh or offensive, but strictly from a medical/psychological stand point, you WOULD be considered an alcoholic. It may be that this will not be something you can do on your own. If that is the case, I would suggest seeking outside help.

I say this only out of concern. I have 3 family members who died of alcoholism adn 2 more who are struggling with it now. For that reason, I avoid it, the family genes are not going to drag me in.
 
^ good point, I think I am a alcoholic. I dont drink Hard liq too often (maybe once or twice a month, if that), but about 6-7 beers on a daily basis(get that nice feeling beofre I hit the sake). I have tried to get focused but have been unsuccessful, I have a new job lined up as of August 07, 2007. I will no longer be working nights & weekends, I will be working normal Mon-Fri 9-5 job. I want to quit drinking before that point, but it is tough. I need some motivation.
 
Joe, please find help. In a real, flesh and blood way- not just through the computer. The drinking can be stopped...but it probably will not be easy. And, in my honest, heartfelt opinion, quitting the drinking is WAY MORE IMPORTANT than losing weight. The weight could eventually kill you, yes...but the drinking is far more likely to, and much sooner. My uncle just passed away at 46, from trauma directly associated with alcoholism.

Alcoholism is not based on WHAT you drink, so the fact that you do not drink hard liquor is of no difference here. Alcoholism is a person having at least ONE drink per day, every day, for an extended period of time. It is done as normal daily life, and not a social event.

You are past that. At least 5 drinks past that.

I recommend speaking with your primary care physician. If you have insurance that covers mental health, look into a counselor. And, though it sounds cliche, find an AA meeting near you. They have them at all times of day, something can work with your schedule. They will give you a buddy, who has been where you are at and overcome it, to support you WHENEVER you need it. Narcotics Anonymous saved my brother's life, I only wish my uncle had found AA before his was over. Please don't worry about Herbalife, or any other diet drug/pill/supplement, you have something much more important to take care of right now.

My heart literally hurts for you right now, Joe. I want you to know I care. Everything I have written was done in a way meant to help. Please know that. Let me know if I can be of further assistance.
 
Last edited:
I totally agree with AmbaLove on this one....
Docs usually say that wine can be good for you in MODERATION....that's like maybe one or two glasses a month or longer...but it seems like the alchohol thing has got you trapped.....basically like someone who smokes or chews tobacco....Only this messes up your kidneys and your brain...
First things first: get help with the beer then you can worry about your weight
 
Back
Top